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Ancient Noronshasht

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Hoax. zero sources. I continue processing nonsense that Numulunj pilgae (talk · contribs) pumped into Wikipedia who was (ab)using the sutuayion that nobody cares about Mordvins/Mokha/Erzya in enwiki. --Altenmann >talk 23:36, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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@Altenmann: Could you do a better job describing why this is a hoax? I'm having difficulty finding most of the sources, but there is at least one article that is web-readable in Russian (Ikonnikov and Baisheva) which might discuss this, there are a few maps, but I don't know Russian and can't figure this out further. SportingFlyer T·C 04:19, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
- @SportingFlyer: It is a hoax because it is invented. The article of Ikonnikov and Baisheva is about the Goldeh Horde town of Mokhshi in place of the village of Narovchat (Russian: Наровча́т, Moksha: Норзяд). References are fake.For example it says Noronshasht was the capital of the medieval Moksha kingdom Murunza referring to Карамзин Н. М. История государства Российского: - which says nothing of the kind. In Moksha language the village name is mdf:Норзяд and historical names are Нуриджан (Наручать, Наручадь (Nuridzhan ( Naruchat , Naruchad )). The Greek name νορονςαςτ is a fabrication --Altenmann >talk 04:42, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
  Thank you. In that case, I'm leaning delete, but again I can't read the sources, so the closer can feel free to discount my !vote if this is somehow incorrect. SportingFlyer T·C 05:58, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Federation droid

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MOS:DABMENTION: None of these is called "federation droid". The closest you get is "Trade Federation droid [army]" for the Star Wars battle droid, which is not ambiguous. Paradoctor (talk) 22:07, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete Neither entry is called a "federation droid". QuicoleJR (talk) 22:11, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - no evidence for the term. --Altenmann >talk 23:40, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - mishmash of multiple WP:CRUFT entries Waterfelt (talk) 23:45, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Delete: This fictional term is not fit to keep as disamb page. ☮️Counter-Strike:Mention 269🕉️^{(🗨️ ● ✉️ ● 📔)} 08:12, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Mitch Kern

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It appears that this Calgary-based photographer and academic does not meet NARTIST nor GNG for inclusion. It has been almost entirely edited by single purpose accounts that have only edited this article along with a series of WP:SPA IPs from Calgary that added unsourced personal/professional content (now largely cleaned up). The sourcing is almost entirely non-independent primary sources. The article was recently PROD'ed, then de-prodded by one of the IPs. Then IPs from the same range twice removed two maintenance tags (notability, primary sources) without fixing the issues. There is one article on him in the Real Estate section of a local lifestyle paper which is largely an interview (primary). This leaves one good independent source in McCleans on a pinhole camera he uses with his students. I can't find anything to substantiate NACADEMIC, zero hits on Google Scholar. Basically the article shows that he is a photographer with an MFA degree, and a teaching job WP:MILL, but is he notable per WP-criteria? Bringing it here for the community to decide. Netherzone (talk) 21:58, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. No notability of any sort. Xxanthippe (talk) 22:06, 31 December 2024 (UTC).[reply]
Delete fails GNG, NARTIST, NACADEMIC. No acceptable sources are available that would indicate notability for this person. I am not seeing anything that shows this subject qualifies for an independent article on Wikipedia. ---Steve Quinn (talk) 23:27, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. I can't find any evidence that his work is in the collections of multiple notable museums, has been the subject of significant non-local press, or would otherwise pass WP:ARTIST. —David Eppstein (talk) 00:20, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Corentin Rahier

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Non-notable figure skater. Bgsu98 (Talk) 17:24, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep: The one secondary source already in the article (source 2) combined with [[1]] and [[2]] appear to contain enough coverage of Rahier to meet the WP:GNG. Let'srun (talk) 01:27, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Please note that the 2017 Junior Worlds Field Guide: Ice Dance article is from a blog site run by a single person. As such it is most likely not deemed a reliable source per WP:SPORTBASIC. The other two sources look okay at a glance. Alvaldi (talk) 13:57, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Good catch there. Let'srun (talk) 03:17, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:49, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

West of Scotland Schools Symphony Orchestra

AfDs for this article:

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Last AfD was 17 years ago and no consensus. I'm not seeing any extensive coverage to meet GNG or WP:BAND. LibStar (talk) 18:09, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - not enough WP:SIGCOV in reliable sources. See below. starship.paint (talk / cont) 08:02, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
- Google Books link above produces false positives only. Google News link above produces single sentence mentions, or people claiming to have been part of the orchestra. Searched The Wikipedia Library, no results for WSSSO, one result for the full name, which is a single sentence mention in this article. Google Scholar produces three results, of which both the second result (download link) and the third result both only mention the orchestra twice while referencing the research done by the first result. The first result is the only SIGCOV I could find. The researchers administered an online survey to 41 WSSSO youth in 2009 containing many Likert-style questions about their experience, and three open-ended questions: "why did you decide to take part ... why do you continue to take part ... what would stop you taking part? The article is entitled "Advanced youth music ensembles: Experiences of, and reasons for, participation", so it seems to discuss the experiences of being in an ensemble, rather than being a comprehensive history of WSSSO. starship.paint (talk / cont) 14:51, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Update - found 32 results on Newspapers.com. First result is SIGCOV, founding of the orchestra. But the rest of the results are more sketchy and WP:ROUTINE - advertisements, concert announcements and single sentence mentions (Person X is joining the orchestra / the orchestra is performing at location Y). I do not think this is enough. starship.paint (talk / cont) 08:02, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Already brought to AFD before so not eligible for Soft Deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:41, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2018 Crozet, Virginia, train crash

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Fails WP:LASTING and WP:NOTNEWS. Train-truck accidents are very common in the United States. The only reason this specific incident got so much coverage is because there happened to be some politicians on the train. Cutlass ^Ciera 21:40, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. NOTNEWS, WP:SENSATIONAL, LASTING Agree with nom. This is a WP:ROUTINE event that received coverage in some news media outlets because some politicians were involved. Coverage was short lived after the accident, and this event had no significant impact. ---Steve Quinn (talk) 00:11, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
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Keep This one is pretty well written and sourced. Regardless of the Not news and other linked reminders ... Category:Railway accidents and incidents in the United States by state or territory is evidence that these disaster articles are an accepted part of Wikipedia. — Maile (talk) 01:30, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Keep This did have lasting coverage, including coverage that actually occurred over a year after the event - which is already currently in the article - and as such the two arguments for deletion don't apply. SportingFlyer T·C 01:33, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Keep While notability is not inherited, it can be conferred, and the fact this was a special chartered train - not there happened to be some politicans on [it] - means this was notable, and received coverage accordingly. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 01:36, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

2010 Papua New Guinea bus crash

AfDs for this article:

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A WP:News article based on a brief burst of news coverage. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 19:50, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep. This is the worst road accident in the history of Papua New Guinea, which IMHO gives it "additional enduring significance" per criterion #4 of WP:NEVENT. Astaire (talk) 18:37, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. per nom, fails WP:LASTING. Cutlass ^Ciera 22:26, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete The fact that it was the worst road accident in PNG's history makes me hesitant to say delete, but I'm barely even finding mentions of the accident after the burst of initial news coverage. It doesn't seem to have led to any policy reforms, ongoing commemorations etc. that would suggest that it meets WP:LASTING. While it may rank first numerically in terms of the number of deaths, I'm not sure that on its own is enough to demonstrate "additional enduring significance" per WP:NEVENT. MCE89 (talk) 01:20, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: There are no lasting effects on this event as the editors said. No follow-up sources have been found which qualifies WP:LASTING. ☮️Counter-Strike:Mention 269🕉️^{(🗨️ ● ✉️ ● 📔)} 08:15, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

2007 Comilla bus crash

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A WP:News article based on a brief burst of news coverage. Thebiguglyalien (talk) 19:50, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nom, fails WP:LASTING. Cutlass ^Ciera 21:35, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Already PROD'd so not eligible for a Soft Deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2012 Sighetu Marmației explosions

AfDs for this article:

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Fails WP:LASTING, no sustained coverage Cutlass ^Ciera 21:36, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Cydoor

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Fails WP:GNG BryceM2001 (talk) 20:44, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment: @BryceM2001: could you explain what you mean when you say the subject fails WP:GNG? The following sources seem to me like they might establish notability: [3] [4] [5] --Richard Yin (talk) 12:50, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting due to lack of participation. User:BryceM2001, as the nominator, please respond to the question asked of you here. You didn't provide much of a deletion rationale for this article or show that a BEFORE had been done.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:20, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

delete Lacks significant coverage: routine detection announcements only. --Altenmann >talk 00:12, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: Not seeing coverage of the adware more detailed than brief paragraphs, e.g. [6], [7]. There are a few brief articles of the company itself in trade publications such as Adweek, also not enough for notability. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 08:03, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Frog Detective (disambiguation)

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No topics with the exact title. GilaMonster536 (talk) 21:16, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2024 December 24. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 21:27, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Keep - Seems there is more than one way to do a dab. Some like this one. Here's an example: Abu Hanifa (disambiguation). There are enough like this one, that I don't think it's likely to be deleted on style. — Maile (talk) 04:11, 25 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- @Maile66: "Abu Hanifa" is a given name in that example, and given names are generally tolerated as partial title matches. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:53, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep, since Frog Detective is currently a redirect. --Richard Yin (talk) 09:17, 26 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Frog Detective is a primary topic redirect to The Haunted Island, a Frog Detective Game. The disambiguation page is not a valid one, and is not required, because both other entries are WP:Partial title matches and are mentioned in the lead of the primary topic article. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 09:44, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per Shhhnotsoloud. Unnecessary dab, violates several guidelines. – sgeureka ^t•c 09:44, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:18, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - exactly same subject in different media. --Altenmann >talk 00:14, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

2005 Danish Figure Skating Championships

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I am also nominating the following related pages:

Non-notable figure skating competition. Recommend deletion or redirect to Danish Figure Skating Championships. Bgsu98 (Talk) 23:57, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Here is my problem with these stand-alone articles. All four disciplines are often not contested. There are often not enough competitors to award a bronze medal, and in some cases, even a silver medal. Many of these competitions featured no more than two or three participants. And most of the competitors who are listed are redlinked or unlinked (ie. themselves not notable). The competition results and scores are included (or should be included) on a skaters' individual article. The medal results are included on the parent article (in this case, Danish Figure Skating Championships). But these nations with small national championships are just not worth trying to maintain individual articles for each competition. Bgsu98 (Talk) 23:57, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 21:13, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2006 Latvian Figure Skating Championships

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I am also nominating the following related pages:

Non-notable figure skating competition. Recommend deletion or redirect to Latvian Figure Skating Championships. I will attach all subsequent competitions in this series shortly. Bgsu98 (Talk) 23:46, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Here is my problem with these stand-alone articles. All four disciplines are often not contested. There are often not enough competitors to award a bronze medal, and in some cases, even a silver medal. Many of these competitions featured no more than two or three participants. And most of the competitors who are listed are redlinked or unlinked (ie. themselves not notable). The competition results and scores are included (or should be included) on a skaters' individual article. The medal results are included on the parent article (in this case, Latvian Figure Skating Championships). But these nations with small national championships are just not worth trying to maintain individual articles for each competition. Bgsu98 (Talk) 23:49, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
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Mirpur district, India

Mirpur district, India (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views) – (View AfD | edits since nomination)

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Muzaffarabad District, India (edit | talk | history | protect | delete | links | watch | logs | views)

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These articles do not satisfy WP:GNG as there is insufficient independent and in-depth coverage in reliable sources to justify their existence. The claim of the districts being part of India de jure primarily relies on sources mentioning the Indian government’s release of maps in 2019 depicting the districts as part of India. Separate articles are unnecessary for this aspect, as the existing Mirpur District, Muzaffarabad District and Kashmir conflict articles can address India’s inclusion of these districts on its maps as part of the broader Kashmir dispute. These articles were previously CSD’d, but the author has repeatedly restored them. Sheriff | ☎ 911 | 20:59, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Emil Kyulev

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Seems like this person is not notable - no sources, no specific achievements. OSvsOS (talk) 19:44, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep: Article definitely needs improvement, but a cursory search turned up multiple independent news sources chronicling his death and important elements of his life that satisfy WP:GNG, including The Guardian, The New York Times, and The Economist. I just added those references to the article as a start. Waterfelt (talk) 00:09, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
keep. bg:Емил Кюлев plenty of content and sources. --Altenmann >talk 00:18, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Julia Majale

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All the sources Fail WP:GNG and WP: SIGCOV cannot be established. The sources are either primary sources like this and this. The rest were written by the news media she manages and they also lack WP: SIGCOV. Ibjaja055 (talk) 19:37, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Vox Talent

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I can't find any significant coverage of this business. Seems to fail WP:NCORP. – Anne drew (talk · contribs) 18:57, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Can't find any independent references that would satisfy WP:GNG. Waterfelt (talk) 00:32, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Jack C. Mancino

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This article about an Hungarian-born British artist, actor and musician is poorly sourced. Large sections of text are unreferenced. There are seven inline citations, of which five are to IMDb. The one to the Chicago Tribune is geo-locked for me. The other just says "Feszültség és szabadság Lisszabonban", and has been tagged as needing a full citation since 2020. Googling the phrase led me to https://holdkatlan.hu/index.php/szemle/lapszemle/3559-feszultseg-es-szabadsag-lisszabonban which doesn't appear to mention this person, although I do not understand Hungarian. The list of external links doesn't include any reliable sources which could be added as references. I have carried out WP:BEFORE for Jack C. Mancino, Jack Mancino and the alternative name given, Balogh Csaba, and not found references to add. There is an artist called Csaba Balogh who may be notable, but his year and place of birth are different. I don't think this article demonstrates that Mancino meets WP:GNG, WP:ANYBIO, WP:NARTIST, WP:NACTOR or WP:NMUSICIAN. Tacyarg (talk) 18:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Hi! 1. please clarify which "Large sections of text are unreferenced". The newly inserted sections are films and music will be sourced soon. IMDb is a good source for referencing filmographies. Can Soundcloud, Amazon, Spotify or Apple Music or any other streaming site for music be used for referencing discographies? Thank you for helping. 2. It is possible that the owner of the referenced link has changed their site that was correct when it was inserted. This page has been on Wikipedia more than 15 years. Karlmayer5000 (talk) 20:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Hi. The whole of the Biography section is unreferenced, as is the sub-section Early classical stage under Work, and the sub-section Music in the section Acting credits and accolades. IMDb is not a reliable source: see WP:IMDb. The other sites you mention are not reliable sources, but I don't believe discographies need sourcing - as with bibliographies, the existence of the works can be assumed. Tacyarg (talk) 21:00, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

thank you very much. Can you please point me web platforms that qualifies as good source of references to understand the policies. Karlmayer5000 (talk) 06:33, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Please read the reliable sources link and the guidance on your Talk page. The teahouse may also be helpful. Tacyarg (talk) 07:53, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Delete: Can't find any significant coverage anywhere. The first citation refers to this site, which does not provide significant coverage. The Tribune piece just contains a trivial mention. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 08:59, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Fateh Muhammad (Captain)

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The article lacks evidence of notability. It is almost entirely sourced to primary sources. There is one secondary source (Condon) but it merely states that the viceroy complimented Muhammad on the smartness of the battalion and presented him with a walking stick. RegentsPark (comment) 18:20, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Per nom. ☮️Counter-Strike:Mention 269🕉️^{(🗨️ ● ✉️ ● 📔)} 08:17, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Arjun Apparao Jadhav

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I draftified it once, see [8] and it was moved to mainspace by the creator again see [9]. I haven't found any RS in the article and the subject clearly does not pass WP:ANYBIO and WP:GNG. Taabii (talk) 17:59, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. I also couldn't find any coverage of this person or their company in reliable sources. And this is clearly promotional - the claim that they wrote a "famous poem" seems to be sourced only to a) the poem itself and b) their appearance on a podcast. The other sources have unclear authorship and clearly don't support the claim that they are a "rising hero" in Indian entrepreneurship. Clearly not notable. MCE89 (talk) 19:17, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

*Keep I have Seen all RS. these all matches with WP guidlines.and its a early stage entreprenure and i hope that will help this entreprenure to his upcoming life.i also cheack his bussiness site this is awsome its a storytelling platform for childrens or teenagers world changing concept to bulid character of upcoming generations.that man deserves it.to be on WP.some times we have to go beyond the past rules or belif to make something great change in society StoryReader1999 (talk) 20:20, 31 December 2024 (UTC) Struck vote by sock.--Bbb23 (talk) 22:41, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

- Hi User:StoryReader1999, I couldn't help but notice that your comments on this AfD were your very first edit on Wikipedia. How did you find out about this AfD? If you have a connection to the author or subject of this article you should disclose it. MCE89 (talk) 20:31, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
  account is new due to some technical fault my account is vanished. so i'm not new on WP.and i dont have any connection with this article or subject.i found it here /wiki/Wikipedia:XfD_today i have contributed in verious articles StoryReader1999 (talk) 20:48, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

~~:Keep this page is keepable. due to WP:ANYBIO and WP:GNG. this article is not deletable Pune-Writer (talk) 21:33, 31 December 2024 (UTC)~~ Struck sock vote.--Bbb23 (talk) 02:28, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Just noting that commenting on this AfD was User:Pune-Writer's very first edit to Wikipedia as well. MCE89 (talk) 21:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

And they have been blocked as a sock of the same person as the struck-out comment above. Spike 'em (talk) 01:49, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Speedy delete and salt. Created by a sockpuppet. Mvcg66b3r (talk) 22:15, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Speedy delete and salt per MCE89, sock-created spam. Cutlass ^Ciera 22:28, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete non-notable businessman, 3 of the 4 previous sources on page (which I removed) were written by the subject (linking to his instagram page in footer of website). No other significant RS coverage. Spike 'em (talk) 01:48, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

As a matter of procedure, I restored the sources. Generally, it's not a good idea to remove things from an article while it is at AfD.--Bbb23 (talk) 02:28, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Tyner Rushing

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WP:BLP of an actress, not properly sourced as passing WP:NACTOR. As always, notability for actors is not automatically passed just because they've had acting roles -- the test doesn't hinge on listing acting roles, it hinges on showing reliable source coverage about them and their performances to establish the significance of those roles. But this is referenced entirely to unreliable sources that are not support for notability -- IMDb, a YouTube clip and a Q&A interview in which she's answering questions in the first person -- with absolutely no evidence of third-party coverage about her shown at all.
Obviously no prejudice against recreation in the future if and when she has a stronger notability claim than just existing and better sourcing for the significance of her career, but working actors are not automatically exempted from having to pass WP:GNG just because they exist. Bearcat (talk) 17:21, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Political handicapping

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This article is unsourced and largely duplicative of horse race journalism. There might be a small amount of content we can merge into that article. – Anne drew (talk · contribs) 16:40, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Merge and redirect to Horse race journalism, per nom and WP:NOPAGE. Sal2100 (talk) 16:59, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Merge or if not, delete. Even from a sourcing perspective, most potential references to improve the article utilize the language of horse race journalism and not "political handicapping." Waterfelt (talk) 00:17, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Merge and redirect to Horse race journalism, same metaphor. --Altenmann >talk 00:20, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Taker Bazar High School

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There is no evidence that the school is notable. Searches in English and Bengali found no independent, reliable sources. Begumganj Upazila, the sub-district in which the school is located, would be a poor redirect target because we should not simply list there all of the 95 schools in the upazila. Wikipedia is not a directory of all schools that exist or have ever existed. Worldbruce (talk) 16:29, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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List of universities with BDSM clubs

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Fails WP:NOTDIRECTORY and WP:LISTCRITERIA - this is a directory of universities with a specific type of club with no encyclopedic merit past that the club exists. We could perhaps merge the lead into the main article (BDSM). ~ Matthewrb ^{Let's connect · Here to help} 16:04, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete, no merge/redirect. This is simply something that we shouldn't be cataloging here and is certainly not for a general reading audience or anyone actually attending a school. Nate • (chatter) 17:18, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Plenty of pages here aren't written for a "general reading audience", whatever that might be; the people joining these clubs are attending schools; Wikipedia is not censored. XOR'easter (talk) 18:15, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep Passes WP:NLIST due to multiple sources (starting with the first three currently given in the article) discussing the set as a set. XOR'easter (talk) 18:15, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. The sources alluded to immediately above might justify an article for the overarching topic of BDSM clubs at universities, but not a directory (WP:NOTDIR) of universities that happen to have one at the moment (or ever?). WP:IINFO applies here as well -- even in such a hypothetical article, I'd argue against the inclusion of such a listing within it. 35.139.154.158 (talk) 23:15, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
What's "indiscriminate" about this list? It's not a list of all student groups of all types. WP:NOTDIR points to WP:LISTCRITERIA, which is an easy standard to meet here. XOR'easter (talk) 01:29, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
"To provide encyclopedic value, data should be put in context with explanations referenced to independent sources. As explained in § Encyclopedic content above, merely being true, or even verifiable, does not automatically make something suitable for inclusion in the encyclopedia." This doesn't do that, nor is there any particular way that could be done here. The fact that random college X has random student club Y isn't noteworthy. Again, notability of an overall topic is not an automatic license to compile a list of every single example that can be found. 35.139.154.158 (talk) 01:46, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Delete I agree that the sources could justify an article about BDSM at universities. My problem with this list is that student clubs are so temporary and informal that it seems impossible to produce a useful encyclopedic list of universities that "have a BDSM club" in any real sense. The sources in this list range from very credible (e.g. Columbia University) all the way to the many entries that may well have been jokes (universities often make it really, really easy to 'register' a club!), or that appeared in a student media outlet or directory years ago and probably didn't exist for long. One citation is a full twenty years old - surely it's doubtful whether that club still exists? And several entries seem to be for one-off events rather than actual clubs. I think the nature of student clubs just makes it impossible to have a verifiable, objective inclusion criteria for whether a given university "has a BDSM club" in any meaningful sense. Does the club have to have members? Does it have to hold actual events? Does it be more than one person's short term project? At the moment this is really just a list of trivia about universities where something vaguely BDSM-related has ever been reported, not a verifiable list of universities per WP:LISTCRITERIA where you would actually find a BDSM club. MCE89 (talk) 09:29, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Muhammad Sadiq Malkani

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Fails WP:PROF. This guy is mostly known for naming dubious species of dinosaurs and other prehistoric animals in predatory journals like SCIRP. Looking at his scholar citations shows extensive self-citation and very few citations from independent researchers for the vast majority of his paleontology research papers (with the notable exception of "Origin of Whales from Early Artiodactyls: Hands and Feet of Eocene Protocetidae from Pakistan" published in Science in 2001, but he is only 1 of 5 authors and is not the corresponding author). His research is in general widely ignored by paleontologists and has had little impact on the field. His geology-related citations look very run of the mill and not enough to pass PROF either. Also fails WP:GNG as no significant independent coverage. This story in the Pakistan Express Tribune [10] seems like passing coverage to me and not enough for notability. Hemiauchenia (talk) 16:02, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete per nomination. Ta-tea-two-te-to (talk) 16:08, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete no independent coverage. --Altenmann >talk 00:26, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Yubo Ruan

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Limited coverage in mostly poor-quality sources. The Business Insider piece is probably the strongest source in terms of significant coverage and reliability, but even that is questionable. The rest are either trivial mentions or unreliable sources. GorillaWarfare (she/her • talk) 15:48, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment: I would like to point out one of the major contributors of this article appears to be a paid editor finding excuses to remove negative information about Yubo Ruan and OneFootball while expanding their Wikipedia content with questionable sources. 128.100.1.18 (talk) 23:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was speedy delete G5‎. UtherSRG (talk) 02:57, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Ijaz Hussain Batalve

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Proposing deletion per WP:TNT. The article is barely legible and would require major work to fix the language, grammar and style errors. This is in addition to the poor referencing and unreliable sourcing. The article creator was previously given the opportunity to incubate the article in draft space by UtherSRG, but rather than improving it, they've added additional barely legible material. Proposing deletion, with no objection to later re-creation. N.B. - notability of the subject is not in question. Just the quality of the current article. Bastun^{Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ!} 15:13, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: I concur. This needs to be started from scratch. - UtherSRG (talk) 16:31, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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The Master (2009 film)

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Tagged years ago in both languages, and the cite is not enough to show notability. Hard to search for English name as is common word. Chidgk1 (talk) 14:58, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep: I added some sources, one of which is a detailed review by Turkish film critic Atilla Dorsay. TheJoyfulTentmaker (talk) 00:23, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

JOJO (Turkish children's channel)

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Tagged five years ago as uncited. The cites on the Turkish article are not enough to show that it is notable Chidgk1 (talk) 14:46, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Redirect to Çukurova Media Group#Defunct properties Nothing here outside of marking its existence and the usual uncited and vandal-vulnerable programming list. Nate • (chatter) 17:20, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was speedy close‎. WP:U1 deletion has already been requested. (non-admin closure) Spiderone^{(Talk to Spider)} 15:03, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

User:D4KKS

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It's a copy of D4kks. d4kks (talk) 13:07, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Automated comment: This AfD was not correctly transcluded to the log (step 3). I have transcluded it to Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/Log/2024 December 31. —^{cyberbot I}_{Talk to my owner:Online} 13:23, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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The Water Project

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This article about a non-profit is currently only sourced to the organisation's own website and to a BBC article that provides a WP:PASSING mention that a group of hackers donated money to the organisation. The only other sources I was able to find were a WP:HUFFPOCON op-ed by the organisation's CEO [11], a WP:MEDIUM interview with the CEO [12], and a few press releases like these [13] [14], none of which would be considered independent. It was also featured in the 'nonprofit spotlight' section of Philanthropy News Digest in 2018 [15], but this seems more like a repackaging of information from their website rather than anything that could be considered SIGCOV. Overall it seems like an charity that's doing great work, but I don't see anything that suggests it meets WP:NONPROFIT. MCE89 (talk) 13:01, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Unicef and various giving websites mention this project, but nothing for RS we can use. Sourcing in the article is primary, so not helping notability. Oaktree b (talk) 16:54, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Delete: Did a big search and couldn't find anything independent to satisfy WP:GNG Waterfelt (talk) 23:58, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Phoebe Kemi

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Sources are PR pieces thus not meeting the general notability requirement Joseph4real1995 (talk) 12:01, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - Subject clearly meets WP:GNG and WP:SIGCOV, with a feature in Harper's Bazaar. Melmann 12:15, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep per Melmann. I've gone ahead and stubbified it to remove promotional content, but I agree that the subject meets WP:GNG. Note that there's an ongoing discussion about the reliability of Nigerian news media, which could be relevant. --Richard Yin (talk) 12:36, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. The article in Grazia is sigcov. pburka (talk) 17:10, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Christopher Hyde

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Article subject is notable only for a single event, and does not meet the criteria set out in WP:NCRIMINAL. Bastun^{Ėġáḍβáś₮ŭŃ!} 11:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Killing three people during a robbery isn't notable, being on death row neither. Coverage is strictly news items of his various incidents. Oaktree b (talk) 16:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Per nom and the reason NCRIMINAL exists; this man simply is not notable and should not have the glory of their own page. Nate • (chatter) 17:23, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep for now: I created this article thinking it would be notable for a few reasons, 1. His crimes occurred in 2 states, one of which was an attempted murder, had that victim died, he could have had 4 victims killed in separate incidents, some might say that's a serial killer or in this case an "attempted serial killer" 2. case was covered by various news outlets, the Associated Press being the big one as that a national one, also news agencies outside Alabama covered it (Edwardsville Intelligencer: Illinois and Cape Cod Times: Massachusetts) 3. The random location of the crime, I don't recall there being many multiple slayings at Funereal Homes, that stood out to me and I thought that was unique for a triple homicide case. The circumstances of the case overall seemed very unusual. While it may be a stub, a stub can still be notable. YatesTucker00090 (talk) 18:56, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Adam Rutter

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Disputed PROD. Fails to meet significant coverage criteria. Sources cited are just result lists and basic profile things. As the editor who added the "needs additional citations" notice said they are "garbage". I cannot find anything that would class as significant coverage to add. Shrug02 (talk) 11:33, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: No news coverage found of this person, other than confirmation of existence [16]. Sourcing in the article now is primary or directory listings. Oaktree b (talk) 16:58, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Delete. As per Oaktree b.Canary757 (talk) 17:35, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

List of health insurance executives in the United States

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The previous AFD of this article was reviewed at DRV with a closure of no consensus. I exercised my discretion to relist the article here at AFD. This is a procedural nomination with no opinion. Stifle (talk) 11:23, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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I agree with the 'Delete' from the earlier nomination and can't say it better than the closure notice: "the underlying claim that the list fails both WP:NLIST and WP:CROSSCAT was not adequately refuted by those voting Keep." JeffUK 12:35, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - As I said in the previous discussion, this does not meet WP:NLIST because this list, as envisaged here, cannot be demonstrated to be significant as a discrete topic, discussed as a group or set. An editor attempted to answer that with lists of top 10 best paid CEOs, but that is not this set. This list is a list of all health insurance executives, regardless of pay. Not just CEOs, not grouped by anything but that they are heallth insurance executives. The list was created 8 December after one of its members was murdered, and after it was reported that companies were removing information from websites on safety grounds. That is, this list was created - not because of any NLIST criteria that guided it - but because someone thought Wikipedia should have a list of all health insurance executives now, at this time. It is an NLIST fail.
It is WP:INDISCRIMINATE, and a violation of WP:CROSSCAT. List articles can be frustrating because our policies are vague on them, and we often retain list articles that fall in the grey area, but in this case there are very clear reasons why this article should not be retained. This is very clearly a WP:COATRACK, and an absolutely astonishing example of unwise drafting based on current events. Whatever the intentions of the drafter, it could be used as a hit list, but also it is highly likely that it will be used to attack Wikipedia itself. The existence of a page such as this fails on neutrality and public safety. It risks bringing the encyclopaedia into disrepute, and it does not serve any true encyclopaedic function. WP:IAR is Wikipedia policy too, and this is the time to use it.
So it should be deleted for multiple policy reasons, including, but not limited to, IAR. The information about the notable executives remains on their pages, so there is no censorship (defined as an attempt to hide material we think is objectional). But this should be deleted because it is a dangerous synthesis of our source material. That is what a list such as this is. It is WP:SYNTH based on Wikipedia sources, and should not be countenanced because it is bad for people for whom we are painting targets on their back, and bad for the encyclopaedia. The collation of this list adds no encyclopaedic value. It can be safely deleted. It cannot be safely kept. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 13:26, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources.
The subject passes Wikipedia:Notability#Stand-alone lists, which says, "One accepted reason why a list topic is considered notable is if it has been discussed as a group or set by independent reliable sources, per the above guidelines; notable list topics are appropriate for a stand-alone list." I will show below that "health insurance executives in the United States" has been treated as "a group or set by independent reliable sources".

Sources
1. There are sources that discuss President Obama meeting with health insurance executives in 2013. This Washington Post article notes, "The White House hosted a group of health insurance executives this afternoon to discuss - you guessed it! - HealthCare.Gov." This Modern Healthcare article notes:
  Fourteen insurance industry heavyweights were called to the White House Wednesday to advise the Obama administration on how to fix the dysfunctional federal health insurance exchange. ... Kaiser Permanente CEO Bernard Tyson, WellPoint CEO Joseph Swedish, Aetna CEO Mark Bertolini and Humana CEO Bruce Broussard were part of the delegation that met with HHS Secretary Kathleen Sebelius, CMS Administrator Marilyn Tavenner, senior White House adviser Valerie Jarrett, White House Chief of Staff Denis McDonough and Deputy Assistant to the President for Health Policy Chris Jennings. ... Other healthcare industry leaders participating in Wednesday's meeting were: Patrick Geraghty, CEO of Blue Cross and Blue Shield of Florida; Jay Gellert, president and CEO of Health Net; Patricia Hemingway Hall, president and CEO of Health Care Services Corp.; Daniel Hilferty, president and CEO of Independence Blue Cross; Karen Ignagni, president and CEO of the trade group America's Health Insurance Plans; John Molina, chief financial officer of Molina Healthcare; Michael Neidorff, chairman and CEO of Centene Corp.; James Roosevelt Jr., president and CEO of Tufts Health Plan Foundation; and Scott Serota, president and CEO of the Blue Cross and Blue Shield Association."
  This article also lists the "health insurance executives" who participated in the meeting.
2. Hellander, Ida (2002). "A Review of Data on the Health Sector of the United States January 2002". International Journal of Health Services. 32 (3): 587–588. JSTOR 45131234.
  The study notes: "Twenty-three top HMO executives at 15 publicly traded companies received a 60 percent raise to a total of $63.3 million in pay in 2000, excluding stock options. They received stock options valued at another $109.2 million." It discusses Aetna's William Donaldson, Aetna's John Rowe, Aetna's Richard Huber, edHealth Group's William McGuire ($7.7 million); Cigna's Edward Hanway ($5.4 million) and Wilson Taylor ($5 million); Wellpoint's Leonard Schaeffer ($4.8 million); Humana's Michael McCallister ($2.7 million) and David Jones ($1.9 million); Trigon's Thomas Snead ($1.8 million); First Health's James Smith ($1.7 million); MAMSI's Thomas Barbera ($1.2 million) and Mark Groban ($1.2 million); and Pacificare's Alan Hoops ($1.1 million). It also discusses Pacificare's Howard Phanstiel.
3. Livingston, Shelby (2017-05-29). "Silence from healthcare CEOs on AHCA politics is deafening". Modern Healthcare. Archived from the original on 2024-12-31. Retrieved 2024-12-31.
  In the context of healthcare CEOs largely avoiding discussion of the Affordable Care Act, the article lists Paul Markovich, CEO of Blue Shield of California; Northwell Health's CEO, Michael Dowling; and J. Mario Molina, CEO of Medicaid insurer Molina Healthcare.
4. Adeel, Noor Ul Ain; Hammel, Tyler (2024-08-27). "UnitedHealth's Witty was highest-paid US health insurer CEO in 2023". S&P Global. Archived from the original on 2024-12-05. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article lists UnitedHealth Group Inc.'s Andrew Witty; Elevance Health Inc.'s Gail Boudreaux; Molina Healthcare Inc.'s Joseph Zubretsky; Cigna Group's David Cordani; Centene Corp. CEO Sarah London; and Humana Inc.'s Bruce Broussard.
5. Stannard, Ed (2024-03-11). "Health insurance CEOs rake in millions, including in CT. Here's the top 10 list". Hartford Courant. Archived from the original on 2024-03-11. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article lists UnitedHealth Group CEO Andrew Witty, Elevant Health (formerly Anthem) CEO Gail Boudreaux, Centene Corporation CEO Sarah London, Humana CEO Bruce Broussard, CVS CEO Karen Lynch, HCSC CEO Maurice Smith, Cigna Health Group CEO David Cordani, GuideWell Mutual Holding CEO Patrick Geraghty, Molina Healthcare CEO Joseph Zubretsky, and Independence Health Group CEO George Deavens.
6. Formisano, Ronald P. (2015). Plutocracy in America: How Increasing Inequality Destroys the Middle Class and Exploits the Poor. Baltimore: Johns Hopkins University Press. p. 115. ISBN 978-1-4214-1740-0. Retrieved 2024-12-22 – via Google Books.
  The book notes: "Since the passage of the Affordable Care Act, health-insurance executives are being paid millions, reaching Wall Street levels, mirroring the disproportionate compensation that prevails in the United States more than in any other advanced economy. Though they opposed the ACA's new regulations, the CEOs of the 11 largest for-profit companies hauled in packages in 2013 worth $125 million. The biggest winners were Mark Bertolini, CEO of Aetna, whose compensation totaled $30.7 million—a 131 percent increase from the year before—and Centene's CEO Michael Neirdorff, whose earnings climbed from $8.5 million to $14.5 million. Meanwhile, though they are turning large profits, these companies warned patients and businesses that premiums would probably rise in 2015. In 2009, insurance executive Wendell Potter became a whistleblower and began to expose profiteering in the health-insurance industry. He has collected data showing that the more health insurers deny claims, the higher their executives' pay."
7. Sanders, Bernie (2024). It's OK to Be Angry About Capitalism. New York: Crown Publishing Group. p. 126. ISBN 978-0-593-23873-8. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The book notes: "Meanwhile, the six largest health insurance companies in America made over $60 billion in profits in 2021, led by the UnitedHealth Group, which made $24 billion. And, not surprisingly, the CEOs in the industry receive huge compensation packages. In 2021, the CEO of Centene, Michael Neidorff, made $20.6 million; the CEO of CVS Health, Karen Lynch, made $20.3 million; the CEO of Cigna, David Cordani, took home just under $20 million; and the CEO of Anthem, Gail Boudreaux, received more than $19 million in total compensation."
8. Livingston, Shelby (2018-03-12). "Health insurer CEOs see some significant pay bumps in 2017". Modern Healthcare. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article lists Anthem President and CEO Gail Boudreaux; Molina Healthcare's CEO Joseph Zubretsky; Molina Healthcare's previous CEO J. Mario Molina; Cigna CEO David Cordani; Humana CEO Bruce Broussard; and Centene CEO Michael Neidorff.
9. Livingston, Shelby (2019-03-18). "Some insurer CEOs see bigger paychecks in 2018". Modern Healthcare. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article lists Centene CEO Michael Neidorff; Cigna CEO David Cordani; Anthem CEO Gail Boudreaux; Anthem's previous CEO Joseph Swedish; Humana CEO Bruce Broussard; and Molina Healthcare CEO Joseph Zubretsky.
10. Livingston, Shelby (2017-04-29). "Health insurer CEOs awarded raises in 2016 despite a year of tumult". Modern Healthcare. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article lists Aetna CEO Mark Bertolini, Humana CEO Bruce Broussard, Anthem CEO Joseph Swedish, Cigna CEO David Cordani, UnitedHealth CEO Stephen Hemsley, Centene CEO Michael Neidorff, WellCare Health Plans CEO Kenneth Burdick, and Molina CEO J. Mario Molina.
11. Mattera, Marianne Dekker (2006-06-02). "How about cutting insurance execs' pay?". Medical Economics. Vol. 83, no. 11. p. 8. ISSN 0025-7206. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22 – via Gale.
  The article lists UnitedHealth Chairman and CEO William W. McGuire, Humana's President/CEO Michael B. McCallister, Chairman/CEO of Cigna H. Edward Hanway, WellPoint's Larry C. Glasscock, and Aetna's John W. Rowe.
12. Herman, Bob (2022-05-12). "Seven health insurance CEOs raked in a record $283 million last year". Stat. Archived from the original on 2023-08-31. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article notes: "The CEOs of America’s seven largest publicly traded health insurance and services companies cumulatively earned more than $283 million in 2021 — by far the most of any year in the past decade." The article lists Cigna CEO David Cordani and UnitedHealth CEO Dave Wichmann.
13. Herman, Bob (2023-04-27). "Health insurance CEOs set another record for pay in 2022". Stat. Archived from the original on 2023-08-31. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
  The article notes: "In 2022, the CEOs of the seven major publicly traded health insurance and services conglomerates — CVS Health, UnitedHealth Group, Cigna, Elevance Health, Centene, Humana, and Molina Healthcare — combined to make more than $335 million, according to a STAT analysis of annual financial disclosures." The article lists Joseph Zubretsky, the CEO of Molina; David Cordani, the head of Cigna; Bruce Broussard of Humana; and CVS CEO Karen Lynch.
14. Crystal, Graef (2004-10-06). "Well Paid Insurance CEOs vs. 45 Million Uninsured Americans". Bloomberg News. Archived from the original on 2024-12-31. Retrieved 2024-12-31 – via Physicians for a National Health Program.
  The article lists Anthem's Larry Glasscock, Coventry Health's Allen Wise, Wellpoint Health's Leonard Schaeffer, Sierra Health's Anthony Marlon, UnitedHealth Group's William McGuire, Amerigroup Corp.'s Jeffrey McWaters, Wellchoice's Michael Stocker, Aetna's John Rowe, Pacificare Health's Howard Phanstiel, Oxford Health's Charles Berg, Health Net's Jay Gellert, Humana's Michael McCallister.
15. Healthcare executives:
  1. Behm, Carly (2024-05-21). "Kevin Lobo 10th highest-paid healthcare CEO: WSJ". Becker's Spine Review. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
    The article lists 10 healthcare CEOs.
  2. Gooch, Kelly (2024-05-21). "10 highest-paid healthcare CEOs". Becker's Hospital Review. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
    The article notes: "Here are the 10 top-paid healthcare CEOs, according to the analysis:". The article lists Joseph Hogan, Align Technology; Peter Arduini, GE Healthcare Technologies; Andrew Witty, UnitedHealth; Robert Ford, Abbott Laboratories; Gail Boudreaux, Elevance Health; Karen Lynch, CVS Health; Joseph Zubretsky, Molina Healthcare; Samuel Hazen, HCA Healthcare; David Cordani, Cigna; and Kevin Lobo, Stryker.
  3. Galloro, Vince; Vesely, Rebecca; Zigmond, Jessica (2007-07-30). "Trying to compensate: Latest ranking of CEO compensation finds stock options still key to pay as experts monitor for effects of SEC rule changes". Modern Healthcare. Archived from the original on 2024-12-22. Retrieved 2024-12-22.
    The article lists Tenet Healthcare's president and CEO, Trevor Fetter; chairman and CEO of HCA, Jack Bovender Jr.; DaVita's CEO, Kent Thiry; Cigna's H. Edward Hanway; Humana's president and CEO, Michael McCallister; UnitedHealth Group former CEO William McGuire; UnitedHealth's new CEO, Stephen Hemsley; Aetna CEO Jack Rowe; and the chairman, president, and CEO of Universal Health Services, Alan Miller.
WP:CROSSCAT
WP:CROSSCAT says:
Wikipedia articles are not:
- Non-encyclopedic cross-categorizations, such as "people from ethnic / cultural / religious group X employed by organization Y" or "restaurants specializing in food type X in city Y". Cross-categories such as these are not considered a sufficient basis for creating an article, unless the intersection of those categories is in some way a culturally significant phenomenon. See also Wikipedia:Overcategorization for this issue in categories.
This article does not violate WP:CROSSCAT because the grouping of "health insurance executives in the United States" has been discussed in reliable sources for many years. A "non-encyclopedic cross-categorization" would not have so much coverage.
WP:INDISCRIMINATE
Wikipedia:What Wikipedia is not#Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information says that "Wikipedia articles should not be":
1. "Summary-only descriptions of works."
2. "Lyrics databases."
3. "Excessive listings of unexplained statistics."
4. "Exhaustive logs of software updates."
Since this article is none of those, it does not violate WP:INDISCRIMINATE.
The list's scope and its perceived flaws
As defined in the lead, the list's scope is "notable executives of companies in the United States health insurance industry". I consider this to be a clear scope that matches what the sources say.
Some editors above think that the list's scope should be changed. This can be discussed on the talk page. The policies say that articles containing flaws should not be deleted if they can be improved. Wikipedia:Deletion policy#Alternatives to deletion says, If editing can address all relevant reasons for deletion, this should be done rather than deleting the page. Wikipedia:Editing policy#Wikipedia is a work in progress: perfection is not required says, Perfection is not required: Wikipedia is a work in progress. Collaborative editing means that incomplete or poorly written first drafts can evolve over time into excellent articles. Even poor articles, if they can be improved, are welcome.

Advantages of a list
From Wikipedia:Categories, lists, and navigation templates#Advantages of a list:
1. Good for exploratory browsing of Wikipedia.
2. Can be embellished with annotations (further details).
The benefit of this list is that it includes "further details" through having the executive's title and company. A category does not have that functionality. As the sources largely focus on the executives' compensation, the list could be further enhanced by adding this information.
Addressing some comments directly
Given the range of executive titles encompassed and the unlimited time period, we could have any number of chief financial officers, chief risk officers, chief marketing officers, chief technology officers, chief investment officers, chief administrative officers, chief legal officers, chief operating officers, and so forth. – it is likely that nearly all of the people in these roles are non-notable, so they would be excluded from the list. Any executive who is notable should be included in the list.
the list potentially puts people in danger and the conspicuous timing of the list appears to at least celebrate this type of violence – these are not policy-based reasons for deletion. This information is widely publicly available and well-sourced to high quality reliable sources, so the list does not violate Wikipedia:Biographies of living persons. The list passed Wikipedia:Notability#Stand-alone lists before the killing happened. Deletion under this basis violates the policy WP:NOTCENSORED and the guideline Wikipedia:Offensive material. As one AfD participant wrote:
Finally, I think it's dangerous territory to limit the creation of controversial articles based on timing. Was this page made in response to a terrible event? Yes. But at what arbitrary point would we then be allowed to create controversial articles? Who gets to decide what's controversial? Slippery slope. I think the timing of this needs to be taken out of the equation.
This is very clearly a WP:COATRACK – WP:COATRACK defines a coatrack article as "a Wikipedia article that gets away from its nominal subject, and instead gives more attention to one or more connected but tangential subjects". This is a list of health insurance executives in the United States. It does not "ge[t] away from its nominal subject".
But this should be deleted because it is a dangerous synthesis of our source material. That is what a list such as this is. It is WP:SYNTH based on Wikipedia sources – every entry on this list is sourced to a non-Wikipedia source. This list is not based on Wikipedia sources. This list is not WP:SYNTH as it does not "combine material from multiple sources to state or imply a conclusion not explicitly stated by any of the sources".

Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline

There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow the subject to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".
Cunard (talk) 14:06, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Comment on source list As with all sources, those that demonstrate notability are WP:SECONDARY sources. Per WP:PRIMARYNEWS, sources that report news are primary sources. This ought to be obvious in this case. A report that healthcare insurance executives were asked to advise on how to fix healthcare is a discursive primary source. Put another way, the calling of experts together to advise on policy does not show that the list of all who work in the expert industry is a notable list. If the experts are called together as a panel, and if that panel meets repeatedly, and especially if its membership changes over time, then what is notable is the list of members of the expert panel. What such sources do not show is that the list of all people who work in the industry, whether they are considered suitable for the expert panel or not, and whether called to it or not, is a notable list
  I have already described above why the list of top paid executives is not a reason to have a list of all executives. None of these sources meet NLIST, and just reposting this huge table merely buries this AfD with stuff without demonstrating that NLIST is met. It is not. None of these sources meet NLIST, and what we have here is an attempt to work backwards to justify a WP:INDISCRIMINATE list by scraping together any grouping possible. None of them show that this list is notable. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 14:33, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
AS well as being indiscriminate (in general terms) I also think WP:NOTDIRECTORY is also relevant here; there's no context, just a list of people who have at some point, held a certain role. There are many hundreds of people who fit the definition, so a category would be much more useful. JeffUK 14:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Pinging Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/List of health insurance executives in the United States participants: Mbdfar (talk · contribs), TheTechnician27 (talk · contribs), Sirfurboy (talk · contribs), ZimZalaBim (talk · contribs), Kopf1988 (talk · contribs), The Anome (talk · contribs), Dclemens1971 (talk · contribs), GeorgiaHuman (talk · contribs), Jcmcc450 (talk · contribs), Cakelot1 (talk · contribs), Fish and karate (talk · contribs), SchallundRauch (talk · contribs), Ze0n983 (talk · contribs), Prototyperspective (talk · contribs), WikiUser70176 (talk · contribs), DharmaDrummer (talk · contribs), Aaronw1109 (talk · contribs), Rager7 (talk · contribs), BootsED (talk · contribs), SilviaASH (talk · contribs), Snokalok (talk · contribs), LuciusRex5 (talk · contribs), Bluerasberry (talk · contribs), RadioactiveBoulevardier (talk · contribs), Visviva (talk · contribs), Zanahary (talk · contribs), Pedrogmartins (talk · contribs), Acebulf (talk · contribs), HAL333 (talk · contribs), Chessrat (talk · contribs), L1A1 FAL (talk · contribs), TheLoyalOrder (talk · contribs), Babysharkboss2 (talk · contribs), Amber388 (talk · contribs), MildLoser (talk · contribs), Chefmikesf (talk · contribs), Dympies (talk · contribs), MandRaiden (talk · contribs), Astaire (talk · contribs), Conyo14 (talk · contribs), Esolo5002 (talk · contribs), RWall514 (talk · contribs), and Jellyfish (talk · contribs). Cunard (talk) 14:10, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep As I stated before there is no good reason to delete the page as it contains information that is relevant to the healthcare industry. Rager7 (talk) 20:01, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: Pinging Wikipedia:Deletion review/Log/2024 December 23#List of health insurance executives in the United States participants who were not pinged in my previous comment: Alalch E. (talk · contribs), Frank Anchor (talk · contribs), Hobit (talk · contribs), SmokeyJoe (talk · contribs), JoelleJay (talk · contribs), OwenX (talk · contribs), SportingFlyer (talk · contribs), Sandstein (talk · contribs), Robert McClenon (talk · contribs), Spartaz (talk · contribs), and Enos733 (talk · contribs). Cunard (talk) 14:11, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep no valid reason for deletion as before: It would be good to convert this list into a table with more details about each like relevant qualifications and maybe also to make this broader and/or create similar lists for other countries and industrial branches. The timing for this list may be bad but one has to admit that currently there is a lot of discussion and news reports about the article's subject (btw due to that it's now a "culturally significant phenomenon" per WP:CROSSCAT). More articles like it would be useful to e.g. compare politicians' qualifications or CEO salaries among other things within and across countries. It does not fail WP:CROSSCAT, e.g. it's not a "cross-categorization" and is encyclopedic. I agree with the strong argumentation by Cunard above. --Prototyperspective (talk) 14:17, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
One has to admit that currently there is a lot of discussion and news reports about the article's subject - No, there is a lot of talk about the potential for harm to the individual subjects and their families. And that is not the same thing at all. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 14:37, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete As stated by the former closure notice: “the underlying claim that the list fails both WP:NLIST and WP:CROSSCAT was not adequately refuted by those voting Keep.” BootsED (talk) 14:40, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Draftify or else Keep. My opinion is much the same as before.^[a] There is, as far as I can tell, no valid reason to argue that this list is inherently inappropriate for Wikipedia. This is public information about public individuals, and protecting their safety or obfuscating their identities is not our concern as editors; we are WP:NOTCENSORED, and they are already WP:FAMOUS.
If there are concerns as to the editorial quality of the content, or that this list may be redundant to previously existing pages or categories, and no consensus among editors as to whether or not the current state of the list is acceptable, then the appropriate place to resolve those concerns is in draftspace. If the article is not draftified, however, then it should be allowed to remain, provided that the information is presented neutrally and there are no other valid concerns. silviaASH (inquire within) 14:51, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

^ My opinion in the previous AfD was: "This list is not inherently inappropriate, and could be improved, but the timing of its creation is certainly suspect and it is likely to be a vandalism magnet in the near future if kept. As such I think it should be workshopped in draftspace until it meets a higher standard. It can be moved back into mainspace later, provided that it has been sufficiently improved and there is consensus among editors to do so."

Delete on grounds of WP:NOT, WP:NLIST, WP:CROSSCAT, WP:IAR. I will be repeating myself from the previous AfD and also addressing Cunard and other "keep" !voters' takes above:
- This list fails WP:INDISCRIMINATE and WP:NOTDATABASE. In the last discussion Mbdfar identified the scope of the article to executives of companies that manage health insurance. Basically, any person who has ever been a c-suite executive or in an executive senior management position (presidents, chairmen). Given the range of executive titles encompassed and the unlimited time period, we could have any number of chief financial officers, chief risk officers, chief marketing officers, chief technology officers, chief investment officers, chief administrative officers, chief legal officers, chief operating officers, and so forth. Cunard's argument above is that these roles are not in scope if the people holding them are not notable, but that's based on a lead sentence that is easy to change. If we were to decided that the topic is notable (it's not), then the scope could very easily be expanded to include non-notable members of this group. The scope of the article based on its title is truly indiscriminate, and this article seems like a WP:COATRACK to build a database of people in these roles, which again Wikipedia is WP:NOT. (Not to mention this list is going to require immense levels of maintenance to be kept up to date as people switch between different jobs.)
- It fails NLIST because no one has supplied any sources that provide WP:SIGCOV of all of these individuals as a discrete topic. Note that the title is health insurance executives. Every single one of Cunard's sources covers a narrower range (and as discussed in the previous AfD and at DRV, they aren't really SIGCOV of the group). Virtually all of the sources cover healthcare CEOs (a bigger category than health insurance) or health insurance CEOs (a narrower category than health insurance executives). One source covers HMO executives, a narrower category than health insurance. As a result, the list fails WP:CROSSCAT because this list has not been proven to be discussed in reliable sources.
- Finally, I argued before and will argue again for a mildly WP:IAR reason for deletion: that such a list created in the immediate aftermath of the murder of Brian Thompson will be viewed as (although hopefully not used as) a hit list. The fact that the original discussion was heavily canvassed outside Wikipedia suggests there's an inappropriate desire (outside of our community; I am not making any aspersions about the established editors offering good-faith policy-based arguments here) by a segment of non-Wikipedians who want to use this site to make some kind of WP:SOAPBOX statement that Wikipedia should not be used for. Dclemens1971 (talk) 14:54, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete – I've been going back and forth on this; this one's complicated. It was plainly created as a means of slacktivist soapboxing, and its previous deletion discussion was brigaded to hell and back. I think Sirfurboy's argument about "painting targets on their backs" is understandable and needs to be taken seriously. It needs to be acknowledged that it's unequivocally what this article was created for, and it was completely transparent and shameless. That said, I call it "slacktivism" for a reason: it's performative, not meaningfully advancing a cause as much as it is a cheap way for the creator to seek validation instead of taking to the streets and organizing. Absolutely all of this information is easily accessible elsewhere (including the insurance companies' own websites, our articles for these high-profile companies, and our articles on these executives). So I have serious doubts this has the potential to harm anyone in a way that an ocean of information on and off Wikipedia doesn't just as easily facilitate. In the same way that I think deleting this is not action against a cause like some brigaders suggest, I think keeping this (if argued properly) is not action for a cause. I think a lot of what Cunard does above is WP:WIKILAWYERing, engaging way too heavily with the precise wording of guidelines like WP:INDISCRIMINATE instead of their underlying principles. For example, their list of articles feels like literally anything they could find instead of simply picking a handful of very strong examples (e.g. they link to Modern Healthcare, a health insurance trade publication, six times). Moreover, I think a lot of lists suffer from WP:RECENTISM, treatment with kid gloves when it comes to inclusion, and much lower overall quality and oversight, and this is one of them. I came into this sharing Prototyperspective's view that this has potential to be at least vaguely useful as long as it's made into a table format to give more information and keep the types of information consistent across entries (e.g. "name, title, company, years active, education, notes, refs", etc.). However, given how provably vulnerable this topic is to brigading, I have serious doubts that we can maintain its integrity via only allowing bluelinks, because if you create an article about a non-notable exec under the constant threat of off-site 'Keep' brigading at a potential AfD, you can cobble together a dinky little stub to include anything there anyway. Thus, you can manufacture notability. I think it's widely agreed at this point that just moving it to 'List of health insurance companies' to make it more inclusive doesn't work because the US is so unique in how corporatized its healthcare system is. I'm not sure either that draftifying like silviaASH mentions would be useful here; it feels like the two outcomes are 1) it gets immediately moved back into articlespace without meaningful changes or 2) there aren't any changes that can make it inclusion-worthy and draftifying functions as backdoor deletion. Reading DClemens1971's arguments, however, hit the nail on the head for me both as to why Cunard's arguments feel so much like wikilawyering and to why this should be deleted; I 100% agree with what they wrote. This list was extremely poorly thought-out – made impulsively to soapbox without any regard to quality by a new editor who's obviously never read a single one of these guidelines – and now we're getting ad hoc justifications for why it meets inclusion criteria. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 15:58, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete as lacking in added value over a simple category, ie. WP:NOT with a side order of WP:COATRACK. I think this whole list could be replaced with a category Category:American health insurance chief executives, itself a subcategory of Category:American health care chief executives and the to-be-created Category:American insurance company chief executives (itself a child category of Category:Insurance companies of the United States). -- — The Anome (talk) 16:30, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I think this clearly passes WP:GNG/WP:NLIST as it's been covered in secondary sources per Cunard. It's very discriminate, so we can't knock it out on that - WP:INDISCRIMINATE is often incorrectly applied at AfD, and it has been here, this list will never be more than n- people large. It's not a cross-category since it's not non-encyclopedic and has been covered by secondary sources. WP:IAR means we should censor the encyclopedia. Lists of CEOs are specifically allowed by the part of WP:NOT which includes WP:NOTDIRECTORY. I don't actually care what the end result is here and will be un-watching the AfD, but it is important to me our guidelines are followed correctly. SportingFlyer T·C 16:50, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Agreed. Keep. ♦ WikiUser70176 ♦^{(My talk page)} 17:06, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

How is it discriminate? It's defined incredibly loosely as any notable executive at companies in the United States health insurance industry. That's not much definition; it could encompass HMOs, managed care organizations, pharmacy benefit managers, health savings account providers (including banks), long-term care insurers, reinsurers, consultants and service providers to the health insurance industry, technology providers/insurtech. It's insufficiently defined to provide useful guidance to readers and editors, and thus WP:INDISCRIMINATE. And to repeat what I've said above, it isn't a list of CEOs allowed under WP:NOT, it's a list of all "executives," a term that is likewise undefined. 20:10, 31 December 2024 (UTC) Dclemens1971 (talk) 20:10, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep per SportingFlyer. WP:INDISCRIMINATE does not apply, since the inclusion criteria are as clear-cut as we could ever ask for. The list provides value beyond a mere category, since it shows who is CEO of what, which a category isn't set up to do. XOR'easter (talk) 18:29, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep. I'm confused by the process here. Seems I have to read up on the AFD rules. None of the "Reasons for deletion" apply. Neither does WP:INDISCRIMINATE or WP:CROSSCAT. Article has improved considerably and discussion on the possible scope of the article was fruitful. If the list's scope is the problem that can be easily fixed by an introductory note that limits the scope as is common for many lists. --SchallundRauch (talk) 20:31, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, per my arguments at the DRV and the reasoning from Dclemens and TheTechnician. The inclusion criteria are "health insurance executives in the US", which covers a broad range of people and isn't actually limited to just those who are notable, even if that's what the lead currently claims. The blurb format also strongly lends itself toward BLPVIOs (and indeed these are already present!). JoelleJay (talk) 21:01, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
That seems more like an argument for cleanup (and for more precisely articulating inclusion criteria, on the list or on the Talk page). XOR'easter (talk) 01:35, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Keep: The sources by Cunard show that this is a commonly discussed grouping in secondary sources and meets the WP:LISTN accordingly. In addition a simple google search came up with additional sources such as [[17]] and [[18]]. Let'srun (talk) 21:25, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The first article you linked to (from an insurance trade website) is specifically insurance CEOs, not executives in general and not specifically in the health insurance industry (making it irrelevant to this discussion). The second article you link to (from a very niche publication in the form of CEOworld) is the only one I've seen so far that actually talks about other executives (but just by grouping them by salary without any discussion of them as a coherent group). Even then, it ironically illustrates the point shared by Dclemens1971 that 'executive' is too broad and nebulously defined because it ventures outside of the 'main three' executive types (CEO, COO, and CFO) into things like vice executives, CLOs/General Counsel, CAOs, CPOs (Chief Pharmacy Officers), former presidents, co-presidents, "Chief Data, Digital and Technology Officer"s (for when CTO is too pedestrian), etc. And even that is only a small sample of what an "executive" can actually be, because while what you're thinking of is presumably a "chief executive officer" or potentially the C-suite, an "executive" can functionally be anybody. A branch manager is an executive. It's (pardon my French) a total clusterfuck of a term that was chosen impulsively by this list's creator with no regard to maintainability or guidelines because they had an axe to grind and validation to seek. If you create this list caring only about stochastically terrorizing the parasites who run health insurance companies in the US, this is fine, because the more the merrier. But we're here to build a sustainable encyclopedia, and Spartaz is entirely correct about the fate that awaits this list. Not only is this list's fate being a useless, poorly defined piece of crap, but choosing to 'Keep' now after two discussions will set a precedent that we shouldn't delete it when it inevitably hits the exact moribund, dead-end state they're describing. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 00:31, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
delete this is a ridiculous list concept and would far much better managed though a category. If kept we will be left with a monstrous long list of indiscriminate names and roles that has next to no useful information that will quickly become historical and moribund as interest moves on. It's also a safety risk and adds no meaningful benefit over adding cats to the articles of the actually notable executives. Best to be rid. Spartaz ^Humbug! 21:57, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. A list of all "executives" is meaningless, as the term "executive" isn't being defined, Wikipedia is not an indiscriminate collection of information or a directory of various people who happen to work in a field that is receiving a lot of attention at the moment. Cutlass ^Ciera 22:32, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep I don't want to beat a dead horse with what I have said on previous discussions, but my opinions align with those of Cunard. As a group, I believe the subject meets notability as demonstrated above, and this list is a useful navigational aid that helps build the web. I do understand the WP:CROSSCAT argument, however, this occupation is almost uniquely American, or at the very least most notable in an American context. I will reassert my opinion that the idea that a list such as this is dangerous is just silly. Plenty of groups with bad PR have lists that you would not question. Is List of Islamic State members inappropriate? Would those arguing that this is a "hit list" not consider FBI Ten Most Wanted Fugitives so? The timing of this article's creation cannot be considered. There is no precedent and no basis for delaying or deleting an article because it is controversial. As it stands, the article in question is appropriate and encyclopedic. Mbdfar (talk) 00:09, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
MOS:BUILD, which you've linked, is about how and when to link to other existing articles on a technical, stylistic level, not about what should and shouldn't be included as a standalone article or list on the English Wikipedia. Using a link to the Manual of Style to justify inclusion is exactly as much of a non sequitur as if I were to link to a behavioral guideline like WP:AGF to justify inclusion. TheTechnician27 (Talk page) 00:53, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
It is linked as a reminder of one of the core tenants of Wikipedia. This list serves to help readers access relevant information on other Wikipedia pages easily. Purposefully obscuring the connection of the subjects of this list goes against this tenant. Mbdfar (talk) 01:15, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
did chatGPT write that as it sounds good but has absolutely no meaning. And it's not policy either. Spartaz ^Humbug! 08:21, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as it is an WP:INDISCRIMINATE and undefined list of "executives" whatever that means (every company on the planet defines this level of employee differently). It there are numerous notable CEOs of a particular industry, a category takes care of that. We don't need a WP:DIRECTORY of every single industry's leadership. --ZimZalaBim ^talk 02:42, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Delete per my comment on the previous AFD: Timing is very suspect and does make it much harder to search for sources under WP:NLIST, but I couldn't find anything independent of the recent shooting that mentions the CEO's as a group. Esolo5002 (talk) 04:18, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Hyper (2018 film)

(Find sources: Google (books · news · scholar · free images · WP refs) · FENS · JSTOR · TWL)

As it is, films without 2 reviews don't get articles. This film only has 1 The Times of India review. The other News18 source pertains only to the release of the film's trailer. If deleted, move Hyper (2016 film) to Hyper (film).

Needs more production sources, to save this. DareshMohan (talk) 10:25, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Film and India. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 10:36, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Source assessment table

Source	Reliable?	Significant?	Notes
News18 [19]			This is the first movie in Kannada for Ganesh, who has previously worked in Tamil cinema. It is a story that tells the importance of relationships, and the songs have been shot in many places including Jammu and Kashmir and Madikeri.
The Times of India [20]			reliable for reviews only — See WP:TOI. Note that WP:RSN considers Times of India to have a reliability between no consensus and generally unreliable (2024 RfC). Uncontroversial content such as film reviews are usable
Indiaglitz [21]			Removed from the film article, see Wikipedia:WikiProject_Film/Indian_cinema_task_force#Guidelines_on_sources. Nonetheless, it has crucial production information such as "The shooting for this film was held in Jammu and Kashmir, Madikeri, Bengaluru and other surroundings. The talkie portion was held in hilly region of Karnataka Madikeri. This ‘Hyper’ is not just a love story but also explain father and daughter emotional relationship".
Indiaglitz [22]
Kannada Prabha [23]			Removed from the film article. While Kannada Prabha is reliable, this is just a video source of the trailer with the text: Hyper movie trailer The trailer of Hyper movie starring Arjun Arya and Sheela has been released. The movie is directed by Ganesh Vinayak.

Richard Stannard

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This page appears to be adequately covered by

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stannard Twiceuponatime (talk) 09:43, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Mallzee

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Mallzee shut down in 2021. The article was flagged for neutrality and promotional content in August 2017, it is written mostly like a self-interested ad, and with the lack of any changes to rectify those issues or any edits to indicate the business shut down evidences minimal interest in article. At present, I feel the article doesn't provide encyclopaedic value and given the years of opportunity since the closure of the business without as much as an update indicating such, I doubt the quality of this article will improve. ~ Chip 🐺 08:35, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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I don't believe it passes WP:NORG, even considering some articles, the coverage was incidental. ~ Chip 🐺 08:42, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, already brought to AFD so not eligible for Soft Deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 09:13, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Maxwell Gratton

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Nominated by Ponyshine as not notable. (But the AFD was broken; I'm just fixing that and the discussion page.) -- Beland (talk) 08:21, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Thank you. This is pretry straightforward to me - subject simply doesn’t meet notability threshold. Yes for delete from me. Ponyshine (talk) 08:56, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 09:12, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Weak delete I think this is somewhat borderline. The two Canberra Times articles are definitely very solid, and there is some additional coverage that mentions him in passing when he was at FFV [24] as well as a fair bit of coverage in soccer-focused publications - e.g. [25]. He's probably most notable for being the first gay man to be the CEO of a major sports organisation in Australia, and has received a fair bit of coverage in queer media for that (surprised that the article doesn't really mention this!) and for his role at MQFF - e.g. [26], [27] and [28]. There are also some passing mentions of him as a Liberal preselection candidate [29] [30], although I unfortunately wasn't able to find any coverage of his 2006 state election candidacy. I think the strongest sources are the two Canberra Times articles and the Star Observer piece, which I think are almost enough to meet GNG, but there's nothing else that could really be considered SIGCOV of Gratton himself. So I'm leaning delete, although I think one more piece of SIGCOV would probably be enough to change my mind. MCE89 (talk) 18:17, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Arcadia Global School Dubai

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There are no independent reliable sources with significant coverage that are not reviews, guides or PR pieces using the same images. The sources do not pass the WP:SIRS check and fails NCORP. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 08:08, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, no eligible for Soft Deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 09:09, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep - The subject have enough media coverage such as from The National, Which School Advisor, Which School Advisor, Which School Advisor etc. However, other sources are just passing mentions. Mysecretgarden (talk) 12:08, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Mysecretgarden, if you were familiar with WP:SIRS and had evaluated the sources properly, you would know that the first source you linked is a passing mention and the other three are PR articles. None of these are independent sources. Jeraxmoira🐉 (talk) 13:31, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete - This is a private school in Dubai, so the nom. is correct to apply WP:NORG as the appropriate guideline and sources must meet WP:SIRS. In particular, coverage should be at WP:ORGDEPTH. The article in the national has a photograph from the school but does not even mention it in the article (which is about the rise in the general private school population). All the Which School Advisor articles count as one (multiple articles from a single source) and are also not independent. Likewise there is nothing in the article that meets SIRS and my searches have drawn a blank too. Not quite sure why this was not suitable for soft deletion. I don't see a former PROD. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 14:05, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The following discussion is an archived debate of the proposed deletion of the article below. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

The result was Speedy deleted by BusterD (talk · contribs) per G4 Schützenpanzer (Talk) 15:39, 31 December 2024 (UTC)‎.[reply]

People's Republic of Zhongtai

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This article fails the notability guidelines for events, WP:EVENT. Putting the awful translation on the English Wikipedia aside, if one properly translates or understands the article on the Chinese Wikipedia, it should be clear that the topic is not a micronation or an organisation, but a restaurant owner playing a practical joke and putting up some unique decorations inside his restaurant.

Aside from the descriptions of the Chinese authorities' unextraordinary inspection and the decorations put up by the restaurant owner, the prose consists of original analysis. The main claim that a micronation, the "People's Republic of Zhongtai", was declared is not supported by any of the sources given. The editor(s) on the Chinese Wikipedia described what a micronation was, cited sources for said description, and made the original conclusion that the restaurant owner's joke constituted a micronation being created. Nowhere in this article or the Chinese article is this latter conclusion sourced. So if the topic of this article is not a micronation, what is it?

Most of the sources given merely describe the event that took place: Chinese authorities carried a routine and expected health inspection, a restaurant failed the inspection, and the restaurant owner declared his property was actually an independent country. However, the authorities took this as a joke and did not charge the restaurant owner with separatism or political dissidence as would be expected if they did take his declaration or the nature of his claim somewhat seriously. Instead, the Communist Party–run China Daily published a satirical cartoon about the incident (first source given on the English Wikipedia).

Micronations, as even this article's translation points out, tend to issue items that mimic sovereign states, such as flags, emblems, stamps, currency, passports, etc. However, the two Wikipedia articles and the sources given only describe an emblem being made. Thus the topic is not about a micronation, but an individual making a joke in defiance of a local law, and hanging up a decoration as part of the joke.

As an event, this topic fails notability guidelines:

The coverage in the sources given is non-existent or minimal, either a few sentences describing the event or mentioning it in passing.
There is no lasting legacy outside of online discussions from what I can tell from the sources given and online searches.
There is no widespread international or national coverage.

The main claim of the article is also false and based on original research, i.e. it is not a micronation but a practical joke. Translation quality aside, if we remove all the unsourced content and the originally researched sections, we are left with a description of a local prank with weak coverage by reliable sources. If a topic like this warranted a Wikipedia article, then we'd have a dozen a week about sovereign citizens in the U.S. Yue🌙 07:50, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Also worth noting that the previous deletion discussion brought up the exact same points, and that iteration of the article was also (apparently) machine translated. Yue🌙 07:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Doesn't this qualify for CSD G4 in that case? The zhwiki article was substantially the same in 2014 as it is now. Remsense ‥ 论 08:58, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I did not notice the previous discussion until after publishing this one. We'll see what the responding administrator thinks. Yue🌙 09:17, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of the debate. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page (such as the article's talk page or in a deletion review). No further edits should be made to this page.

Maoist Communist Party (France)

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Fails WP:ORG. Every source given is from the organisation itself or a Maoist blog site, except one by the conservative tabloid Diario Correo, which mentions the French organisation in passing. Online searches in English, French, and Spanish return zero reliable sources, and I doubt such sources will be found in print offline. Yue🌙 06:35, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment I found multiple sources in French which discuss the party, especially in relation to the Gilets jaunes: "Morts aux porcs": de violents tags anti-police en plein Paris, "De Rugy Escroc on te fera payer": qui est le Parti Communiste Maoïste qui revendique ce tag?, Nantes. Tags sur son mur de résidence : qui menace François de Rugy?, Vice interview with a PCM member, Montpellier: le préfet accuse des groupes révolutionnaires communistes d'infiltrer les manifestations des gilets jaunes, Droite identitaire, gauche radicale : quand les extrêmes gonflent les rangs des Gilets jaunes. Need to look at this further, but "zero" reliable sources appears incorrect. Regards, --Goldsztajn (talk) 15:00, 18 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The party is underground now but still actively exists, but it clearly needs updates and translations. DuCouscous (talk) 12:13, 23 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting. So, sources do exist. User:Goldsztajn are you arguing for a Keep here?
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:18, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

I made a mistake, the party doesn't exist anymore, this article should be deleted. There has been no action claimed by the PCm the past 2 years and according to witness it ceased any operations. DuCouscous (talk) 19:08, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:37, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Sharan Kaur Pabla

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"Sharan Kaur" was a fictional character created by the author Vir Singh in a fictional novel. There are literally no reliable sources to support that "Sharan Kaur" was an actual historical figure. MaplesyrupSushi (talk) 07:00, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Fails WP:GNG. Even disregarding the inaccuracies, this article has only one source supporting it. A Google search found some websites which support his existence, such as this one, but this website is far from noteworthy coverage nor is it a reliable source. Even the most popular result, from SikhiWiki, cites Wikipedia as a reference, making it unusable. Jordano^5³ 07:54, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, already PROD'd so not eligible for Soft Deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:34, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Vampire Beach

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Cites no sources, couldn't find any, doesn't look notable at all. I was mildly surprised to find that the book exists at all, although it does seem to! theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 06:22, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. I very vaguely remember these being released back in the day, when I was working at a bookstore. If I remember correctly, this series was intended to capitalize on the popularity of series like Twilight, Gossip Girl, and Pretty Little Liars. Quite a few publishers were trying to capture that lightning in a bottle that those series obtained. In any case, it didn't really get much mainstream attention - I can't find anything out there to suggest otherwise either. This released, sold well enough to warrant a few books in the series, but just never received any coverage in places that Wikipedia would see as a reliable, notability-giving source. ReaderofthePack(formerly Tokyogirl79) (｡◕‿◕｡) 14:22, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Keep per the significant coverage in multiple independent reliable sources. Wikipedia:Notability (books)#Criteria says:
A book is presumed notable if it verifiably meets, through reliable sources, at least one of the following criteria:
1. The book has been the subject of two or more non-trivial published works appearing in sources that are independent of the book itself. This can include published works in all forms, such as newspaper articles, other books, television documentaries, bestseller lists, and reviews. This excludes media re-prints of press releases, flap copy, or other publications where the author, its publisher, agent, or other self-interested parties advertise or speak about the book.
Sources
1. Housden, Ellie (2006-08-19). "books kids". The Courier-Mail. ProQuest 354009468. Archived from the original on 2024-12-27. Retrieved 2024-12-27.
  The review provides 243 words of coverage about Vampire Beach: Initiation. The review notes: "Initiation isn't as wholesome as some teenage fiction; there's some drinking and suggestions of lust that have nothing to do with blood. But the moral of the story is that modern vampires, like ordinary teenagers, have to exercise restraint in their drinking habits to avoid discovery."
2. Jacob, John (Fall 2006). "Vampire Beach: Bloodlust" (PDF). The Alan Review. Vol. 34, no. 1. p. 41. EBSCOhost 507925514. Archived from the original (PDF) on 2024-12-27. Retrieved 2024-12-27.
  The review provides 171 words of coverage about Vampire Beach: Bloodlust. The review notes: "This is a well-written tale of school life in Malibu, and this book is only one in a series of books about Jason and his sister, Dani, and their “friends” in the high school where they have come to live. ... Only rogue vampires kill and, of course, Jason must confront both the rogue and his competition at school, in a tale that is meant to flow into other stories."
3. McGarvey, Paul (2006-08-12). "Bookshelf: Vampire Beach: Bloodlust, by Alex Duval". South Wales Argus. Archived from the original on 2024-12-27. Retrieved 2024-12-27 – via Newspapers.com.
  The review provides 146 words of coverage about Vampire Beach: Bloodlust. The review notes: "For the large part, Duval makes no such attempt to do anything original with this Lost Boys-meets-the-OC tale of beautiful immortals in sunny Malibu. ... Towards the end of the novel, Duval takes a great many liberties with the vampire mythology, none of which I can reveal here without spoiling the plot. However, this is an enjoyable enough and breezy read for fans of trashy teen fiction."
4. Squires, Lorraine (August 2006). "Paperback Series Roundup". Voice of Youth Advocates. Vol. 29, no. 3. p. 236. EBSCOhost 502888926.
  The article provides 97 words of coverage. The article notes: "Another twist on the lives of the young and fabulous comes from Vampire Beach, a series that owes a debt to both Beverly Hills 90210 and R. L. Stine. Jason Freeman moves with his parents and younger sister from Michigan to exclusive Malibu Beach, where he falls in with the super-rich, super-hot, popular crowd. But partying has a truly dark side--a girl turns up dead with suspicious bite marks, and Jason discovers that beautiful people can be deadly. This take on vampire myth will drive purists crazy, but might sell well to A-List and The OC fans."
  The article lists the books in the series:
  Vampire Beach by Alex Duval. Simon Pulse/S & S. 3Q 4P J S
  Bloodlust, Book One. 2006. $5.99. 1-4169-1166-9.
  Initiation, Book Two. 2006. $5.99. 1-4169-1167-7.
5. Atkinson, Frances (2006-12-17). "Big Books - Small Readers - Book Review". The Age. ProQuest 367472866. Archived from the original on 2024-12-27. Retrieved 2024-12-27.
  The review provides 81 words of coverage about Vampire Beach: Initiation. The review notes: "This second book in the Vampire Beach series is unashamedly cheesy but who can resist the winning combination of Malibu, wealthy teens, seduction and vampires? Jason, the new kid in town, falls for sultry Sienna Devereux as his friend Tyler becomes involved with the "wrong crowd" (the sort that have fangs). Brimming with teen-speak and popular culture references, Initiation is the book you can't wait to read on the beach, although you may have to leave it buried in the sand."
6. "Vampire Beach: Initiation". The Bookseller. No. 5234. 2006-06-16. p. 36. EBSCOhost 21394113.
  The review provides 48 words of coverage about Vampire Beach: Initiation. The review notes: "Return to the glamour and intrigue of DeVere High, where the cool crowd are in fact the undead and bloodsucking has never been so cool. I can't help loving these books, they are out-rageously addictive, super cool, and as sharp as a wooden stake right to the heart."
7. Fonseca, Tony (2011). "Young Adult Vampire Fiction". In Joshi, S. T. (ed.). Encyclopedia of the Vampire: The Living Dead in Myth, Legend, and Popular Culture. Santa Barbara, California: Greenwood Publishing Group. pp. 415–416. ISBN 978-0-313-37833-1. ProQuest 2134512314. Retrieved 2024-12-27 – via Google Books.
  The book provides one sentence of coverage about the subject. The book notes: "In the last five years, the number of YA vampire series has skyrocketed. Popular series include ... the Vampire Beach series by Alex Duval (Bloodlust [2006], Initiation [2006], Ritual [2007], and Legacy [2007]); ..."
There is sufficient coverage in reliable sources to allow Vampire Beach to pass Wikipedia:Notability#General notability guideline, which requires "significant coverage in reliable sources that are independent of the subject".
Cunard (talk) 12:50, 27 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

No, I don't think this isn't significant coverage in reliable sources. Most of this looks like plot recap, with a few quotable quotes that maybe express some kind of feeling/opinion.

Sure, Housden 2006 provides 235 words of coverage in theory, but all but 46 of those words are straight plot recap and are pretty much useless for notability/citation purposes. And as far as analysis goes, I don't exactly find modern vampires, like ordinary teenagers, have to exercise restraint in their drinking habits to avoid discovery. to be inspiring. (That's half of what i'm calling 'analysis'.)
Jacob 2006 is actually pretty good, although them putting the town after the name makes me feel like it's reader submitted.
McGarvey 2006 is also mostly plot recap, not SIGCOV.
Can't access Squires 2006.
Atkinson 2006 is a small paragraph in large font with barely anything useful in it.
Can't access The Bookseller.
C'mon, Fonseca 2011 clearly isn't SIGCOV.

Taken together, I think calling these the basis for an article would ultimately yield an article that ignores a lot of best practices – like citing sources that make an effort, instead of the routine 75-word book review mill. theleekycauldron (talk • she/her) 17:04, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

The American newspaper The Courier-Mail, the American journal The Alan Review, the Welsh newspaper South Wales Argus, the American magazine Voice of Youth Advocates, the Australian newspaper The Age, and the British magazine The Bookseller are not "book review mill[s]". These are all respected publications. Wikipedia:Notability (books)#Criteria says a book is notable when it "has been the subject of two or more non-trivial published works appearing in sources that are independent of the book itself". The notability guideline for books does not say that "straight plot recap" are "pretty much useless for notability/citation purposes". In fact, there was a strong consensus in the August 2023 RfC at Wikipedia:Village pump (policy)/Archive 186#RfC on requiring non-plot coverage to demonstrate book notability against amending the notability guideline to add this text:

When assessing whether a book is notable the content of the source must be considered. Plot descriptions and quotes from the book should be omitted when determining whether a source contains significant coverage.

Until and unless the notability guideline is changed to exclude the plot summary parts of sources from contributing to significant coverage, they do contribute to significant coverage. These sources contain sufficient independent analysis and commentary that decent-sized sections that go beyond plot summary can be written at Vampire Beach#Background and Vampire Beach#Reception. Jacob 2006 is not reader submitted. According to the Winter 1994 issue of the journal, John Jacob was an Associate Professor of English at North Central College in Naperville, Illinois. Cunard (talk) 01:32, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Theleekycauldron: The excerpts Cunard posted are the entirety of the coverage Squires 2006 and The Bookseller (accessible via TWL here) provides of this series. ARandomName123 (talk)^{Ping me!} 22:47, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment: This is one of those situations where it would be helpful to have a notability criteria for book series. Out of all the reviews Cunard posted, I'd only consider the first three (and maybe 4/5, but its a bit shaky) to provide sufficient coverage to count towards NBOOK. The problem is most (not 4) of them are reviewing the individual books, not the series. If this were an AfD for an individual book, then two would be enough, but since this is for the series, do we still need only 2 for notability, and if so, do they have to be coverage of the overall series? Or is reviews for a decent portion of the series enough to justify a series article. ARandomName123 (talk)^{Ping me!} 22:35, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting as I don't see a consensus here yet on whether the sources cited provide SIGCOV.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:30, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Verlag Anton Saurwein

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I couldn't find any significant coverage of this company, failing WP:NCORP. – Anne drew (talk · contribs) 07:19, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Senco Gold Limited

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This article fails WP:NORG , the sources listed here do not provide the coverage required by stringent WP:CORPDEPTH and most sources I found in WP:BEFORE search were unusable for establishing notability as they fell under the purview of WP:NEWSORGINDIA, the history of socking and undisclosed paid editing can't be overlooked either, see Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/Soumya511569- Ratnahastin (talk) 05:15, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting to solicit more participation. By the way, the correct SPI is Wikipedia:Sockpuppet investigations/BNJ Nilam.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 04:52, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

~~Weak Keep~~ Delete @Ratnahastin, you are right that WP:NEWSORGINDIA is a big problem when it comes to checking notability in India. However, in this case, since the page is about a listed company, I have found three sources that are independent analyst reports with disclaimers. - HDFC Securities, SBI securities, and ~~SMIFS~~. But I am not sure how many such reports are needed to establish the notability of these types of companies or how relevant they are. Charlie (talk) 14:04, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:12, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Comment The SMIFS analyst report I shared earlier has been struck through. On page 13, it mentions that SMIFS or its associates may have received payments for products or services not related to investment banking or brokerage from the company mentioned in the report over the past year. Because of this, I am pulling back my earlier weak keep vote. As of now, just two analyst reports alone aren’t enough to prove notability. I should have read the disclaimer carefully. Sorry for the mistake. Charlie (talk) 11:34, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Bananana

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Neither List of programmes broadcast by ntv7 nor List of programmes broadcast by 8TV (Malaysian TV network) mentions anything named Bananana. Also, Banananas Music is a partial title match. So, a disambiguation page like this is not needed. GTrang (talk) 04:44, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete This appears more as if it were created from search engine results rather than from content found on Wikipedia, therefore making it functionally useless. Waddles 🗩 🖉 19:38, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge/redirect to Banana (disambiguation) Plausible misspelling; the 8TV block is actually mentioned on List of programmes broadcast by TV3 (Malaysia) so that was in error, and it seems like it moved to NTV7 during a time 8TV carried Nickelodeon programming instead, so it's a duplicate mention. Whatever the case, mention on the dab page as a secondary spelling is proper. Nate • (chatter) 23:46, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Keep. There are two legitimate entries on the page now. Shhhnotsoloud (talk) 10:18, 28 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 07:12, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Beavis

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I am having a hard time finding any WP:SIGCOV about Beavis and Butt-head. Most of the sources talked about the film Beavis and Butt-Head, mostly instead of the characters. 🍕BP!🍕 (🔔) 07:04, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Merge or redirect to either Beavis and Butt-Head or List of Beavis and Butt-Head characters. This is a reasonable search term, so some way to find information about the character should remain, but I agree that there is minimal coverage of just Beavis. RunningTiger123 (talk) 02:40, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Daniel Owiredu

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All the sources fail WP: GNG and the subject of the article does not have the WP:SIGCOV to have a Wikipedia page. The article is ref bombed with press releases with two sentences getting up to 7 references. Ibjaja055 (talk) 02:12, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Keep: @Ibjaja055, I disagree with the assertion that the subject does not pass WP:GNG and lacks WP:SIGCOV. The subject has indeed received significant coverage in reliable, independent secondary sources. Below are some examples:
Robertjamal12 ~🔔 10:49, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Robertjamal12 Thank you for providing all these sources. Prior to nomination of this article, I have gone through all the sources used in the article and additional ones available online. Almost all the sources cannot count toward WP: GNG. Since you have brought these sources up, that should have been the best of them all. Let's do a brief analysis of them.
1st source is a press release about his stepping down as executive officer of Golden star resources and the ascension of a new person. The article is all about the new Chairman, Mr Crew rather than him.

2nd source A press release dismissing allegation against him and lack a significant coverage of him.

3rd source: A source about a non notable award presented to him and also lacked significant coverage.

4th source: Another news report about his allegations without significant coverage.

5th source: This looks like a WP:GNG source but can we use one WP:GNG to establish notability?Ibjaja055 (talk) 20:33, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete: One GNG worthy source cannot establish notability. All other sources are press releases and they lack significant coverage. Ibjaja055 (talk) 20:57, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Ibjaja055. I’m still trying to understand what you mean by lack significant coverage . All the sources you provided have significant coverage about the subject. I suggest you review WP:SIGCOV Robertjamal12 ~🔔 22:11, 29 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
@Robertjamal12 perhaps, you will understand with this. I have broken down each of the sources and you can study my comments alongside the reason why they cannot be used toward WP:GNG. Thank you.

Source assessment table
Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
https://www.myjoyonline.com/executive-vice-president-of-golden-star-resources-daniel-owiredu-re-assigned/	It is a press release about the removal and ascension of the new head.	It is a national daily	It does not discuss the subject directly. It focused on the new head rather than him	✘ No
https://www.modernghana.com/news/719911/gcb-board-chairman-accused.html	A press release dismissing the allegations against him. A statement from the bank...	I Though, it was clarified as unclear here yet I am passing it for this.	It is on the allegations rather than him	✘ No
https://businessghana.com/site/news/business/204438/Accra-Mining-Network-honours-Daniel-Owiredu	A press release about a non notable award	It looked like a National daily though couldn't find it here	It does address the subject directly	✘ No
https://dailyguidenetwork.com/gcb-board-chairman-hot/	Press release about his allegations	It is a national daily	It only focuses on his allegations with little or nothing known about him	✘ No
https://mobile.ghanaweb.com/GhanaHomePage/business/Daniel-Owiredu-is-the-mining-personality-of-the-Year-2017-604726	Though, it looked like a press release but written from news media perspective	It is a national daily	It discussed the subject directly and no original research is needed	✔ Yes
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

@Ibjaja055, I disagree with your assessment of the sources provided regarding the subject's notability. Your review appears to misinterpret the criteria for WP:SIGCOV and WP:GNG.

https://www.myjoyonline.com/executive-vice-president-of-golden-star-resources-daniel-owiredu-re-assigned/ - It does not discuss the subject directly. It focused on the new head rather than him. This source explicitly discusses the subject's tenure and contributions before transitioning from his role. It’s a news article, not a press release
https://www.modernghana.com/news/719911/gcb-board-chairman-accused.html - It is on the allegations rather than him. The allegations themselves are significant coverage directly involving the subject
https://dailyguidenetwork.com/gcb-board-chairman-hot/ - It only focuses on his allegations with little or nothing known about him. This source delves into the subject's standing as GCB Board Chairman and his role in addressing the issues.
https://businessghana.com/site/news/business/204438/Accra-Mining-Network-honours-Daniel-Owiredu - It does address the subject directly. - As you stated it does address the subject directly which you are right

In addition to the sources provided, here are a few as well

The subject pass both WP:GNG and WP:SIGCOV. None of the sources you assessed as press releases are WP:PRSOURCE and all provide significant coverage of the subject. - Robertjamal12 ~🔔 17:20, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Robertjamal12 After this, I am going to literally drop the stick. Your first additional source and the third source are exactly the same as the first source that I called a press release, word for word. A three independent and reliable news media with the same contents word for word and yet you claimed that the source is not a press release. Indeed we are not dealing with press releases here probably a source farming.

The second and fourth are still about his appointment as the head of an organisation that can't make him notable. At this point, I am dropping the stick. Happy editing!Ibjaja055 (talk) 18:03, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

@Ibjaja055 Thank you for taking the time to review my comments regarding the assessment table above. I believe the subject meets the requirements of GNG. I also respect your decision to drop the stick. Wishing you all the best, and happy editing! — Robertjamal12 ~🔔 18:46, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 06:57, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Here's my analysis of each source so far. The verb tense I used is inconsistent, but irrelevant to notability.

https://www.myjoyonline.com/executive-vice-president-of-golden-star-resources-daniel-owiredu-re-assigned/, https://www.classfmonline.com/business/Golden-Star-s-Daniel-Owiredu-steps-down-as-EVP-5014, and https://ghanaiantimes.com.gh/golden-star-announces-changes-to-management-team/, which count as a single source, are definitely not significant. They have the following information:

On 1 January 2020, Owiredu stepped down as EVP and COO of Golden Star and became chairman of the board of directors of two of the company's subsidiaries.

https://www.modernghana.com/news/719911/gcb-board-chairman-accused.html (reliability: unclear), which I has some criticisms so I don't think it's a press release, has the following:

Owiredu is board chairman of the GCB Bank

He is also chairman of the credit sub-committee

He was blamed for a controversy

He was previously president of the Ghana Chamber of Mines and EVP and COO of Golden Star

https://dailyguidenetwork.com/gcb-board-chairman-hot/ is a different news agency writing about the same event with the same information, so I believe it counts as the same source as the above for WP:GNG purposes:

Owiredu is board chairman of the GCB Bank

He is also chairman of the credit sub-committee

He was blamed for a controversy

He was previously president of the Ghana Chamber of Mines and EVP and COO of Golden Star

https://businessghana.com/site/news/business/204438/Accra-Mining-Network-honours-Daniel-Owiredu has the following information and lists "GNA" as a source (which is unclear as a reliable source):

Owiredu is president and chairman of the local board of directors of Golden Star Resources as of 2020

He is a patron of the Accra Mining Network

He has been in the mining business for more than 30 years as of 2020

He is the former president of the Ghana Chamber of Mines

He is committed to helping communities in mining areas

https://mobile.ghanaweb.com/GhanaHomePage/business/Daniel-Owiredu-is-the-mining-personality-of-the-Year-2017-604726 is significant. I won't try to mine that source for information because there's plenty. Its reliability is unclear, but usually high enough for notability purposes.

https://www.modernghana.com/news/23708/owiredu-appointed-md-of-agc.html seems significant. It seems quite promotional, but I'm not sure if it's a press release. Again, reliability is unclear.

Owiredu is the managing director of SAG

He became managing director of ASC's Obuasi Mine

He attended Adisadel College, Kwame Nkrumah University of Science and Technology in Kumasi, University of Strathclyde

He is a mechanical engineer

He joined ASC as an engineer in 1984

He became chief engineer underground after almost 17 years

He helped with the AMEP, which helped turn ASC into a multinational company

He became manager of ASC's Bibiani Gold Project in 1996

"Experts" think his appointment is a good idea

https://www.myjoyonline.com/daniel-owiredu-promoted-to-evpcoo-of-golden-star/ is insignificant and almost certainly a press release, just copy/paste the first paragraph into a google search

Owiredu became EVP and COO of Golden Star on 1 January 2014

He was president of the Ghana Chamber of Mines

I'll hold off on !voting for now.

Regards, PrinceTortoise (he/him • poke • inspect) 10:37, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

My threshold for significant coverage will be "Can I write 50 words about Owiredu using this source?" Per the WP:SIZERULE, we should try to get stubs over 150 words. And I look for three reliable sources as a minimum unless there are two extraordinary sources. So 50 words per source.

Source assessment table prepared by [[User:PrinceTortoise]]
Source	Independent?	Reliable?	Significant coverage?	Count source toward GNG?
Three stepping down as EVP sources	These seem like press releases. Several different publications have very similar wording but conflicting or absent indications of the original source.	Myjoyonline is the second-most trusted new website in Ghana, and there is no reason a press release would be wrong in this case.	The source does not discuss the subject in detail.	✘ No
Modern Ghana "GCB Board Chairman Accused"	Expresses criticisms, so probably not a press release.	Claims editorial oversight, cites the Daily Guide as its source.	Can't contribute as a unique source because it is based on the Daily Guide article.	✘ No
Daily Guide "GCB Board Chairman Hot"	Expresses criticisms, so probably not a press release.	Major newspaper, so hopefully reliable.	The article discusses the subject directly, especially towards the end, and with sufficient detail.	✔ Yes
Business Ghana "Accra Mining Network honours Daniel Owiredu" but see [31] for more information on source	Probably not if Accra Mining also published it.	If it's not independent, then it would be strange if it were unreliable.	Not enough encyclopedic information.	✘ No
Ghana Web "Daniel Owiredu is the mining personality of the Year 2017"	Claims that a journalist wrote this, no evidence of being a press release.	reliable enough on uncontroversial topics	The article discusses the subject directly and in detail.	✔ Yes
Modern Ghana "Owiredu appointed MD of AGC"	Cites Graphic, though I can't find the original source.	Claims editorial oversight, and assuming "Graphic" refers to the Daily Graphic, reliable	The article discusses the subject directly and in detail.	✔ Yes
My Joy Online "Daniel Owiredu promoted to EVP/COO of Golden Star"	Identical promotional articles are found all over the internet.	second-most trusted news website in Ghana	Not enough encyclopedic information.	✘ No
This table may not be a final or consensus view; it may summarize developing consensus, or reflect assessments of a single editor. Created using {{source assess table}}.

I think that's three sources contributing to meeting the general notability guideline. Keep. PrinceTortoise (he/him • poke • inspect) 22:09, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Kanal D (International)

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Tagged 7 years ago as completely unsourced. I only found one reasonable source https://www.milliyet.com.tr/magazin/cannesa-kanal-d-damgasi-7219054 Chidgk1 (talk) 06:57, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment - I found some sources from a turkish newspaper Hürriyet Daily News, Varity, issue and BBC. Mysecretgarden (talk) 10:14, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Passing mentions. For a company such as this we need sources that meet WP:CORPDEPTH. Click the link and you'll see the kind of thing required. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 13:48, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Fairly obvious merge into Kanal D, though that article requires substantial attention. Sammi Brie (she/her • t • c) 16:48, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Merge per Sammi Brie. There is certainly not sourcing to support a standalone article. Sirfurboy🏄 (talk) 18:16, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Julian R. Day

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I am unable to find any news articles or publications about Julian R. Day (though it was hard to filter out results for the Julian day). This is a similar situation to User:Allykmac's other article, Graeme Brosnan (AfD here).

Almost all the citations are primary sources, ie. company/conference bios written by Day himself; the sole secondary source, "How $115 led to over 200 court appearances", is a review of his book on someone's personal blog. I don't believe Julian Day meets notability requirements. Iiii I I I (talk) 06:29, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete. I found a bit of local news-y coverage of his charitable initiatives, but it's pretty weak and I don't think any of it could be considered SIGCOV [32] [33] [34] [35] [36]. I don't think he comes close to meeting WP:GNG or WP:AUTHOR. MCE89 (talk) 18:45, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Kheyrollah Ghahramani

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Fails notability, he probably won some youth medals but achieved nothing in major events in senior level. The article claims he won two silver at 2012 and 2013 Asian Senior Championship but that's not correct and he never even made it to those competitions. Sports2021 (talk) 01:13, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment: Not sure how much help it is, but this source suggests he did in fact have a silver at the Asian championships and a bronze at world championship. [37] Lee Vilenski ^{(talk • contribs)} 08:25, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
- Unfortunately this source fails to mention these medals are in cadet level. this is his resume in UWW database. as I said he never won anything special in senior level. Sports2021 (talk) 10:32, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 05:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete I agree with Sports2021, lacks notable accomplishments, in my opinion the subject fails notability. Lekkha Moun (talk) 08:32, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Nathalie Beasnael

AfDs for this article:

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While it has been improved from its poor state after creation by a subsequently blocked sock, this is still a WP:PROMO biography for a non-notable individual. Sources are limited to:

The subject's own writing and thus WP:PRIMARYSOURCEs ([38], [39], [40], [41], [42], [43], [44], [45], [46])
WP:PRSOURCEs ([47], [48])
Churnalism based on interviews solely with or statements solely by the author (and thus also primary sources) ([49], [50])
Primary source official bios ([51], [52])
A WP:TRIVIALMENTION ([53])

Meanwhile, the awards she has received are not of the kind to qualify her as notable under WP:ANYBIO. Nothing qualifying came up in a WP:BEFORE search. Bottom line: fails WP:NBIO, WP:GNG. Dclemens1971 (talk) 03:57, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete - I had the same concerns while editing the article recently. Ligaturama (talk) 09:41, 17 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Relisting, not eligible for a Soft Deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, Liz ^{Read! Talk!} 03:48, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 05:46, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

American Equestrian Trade Association

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Fails WP:NORG. Insufficient independent in-depth sources to establish notability. Currently defunct.Seems to have been created by COI user. Imcdc Contact 04:58, 24 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete – Trade organization with little to no reliable secondary coverage. All the coverage about it that I could find appears to be promotional in nature. Does not pass WP:GNG nor WP:NORG. Thanks for assuming good faith. Missvain (talk) 22:08, 30 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Relisted to generate a more thorough discussion and clearer consensus.
Relisting comment: Previous WP:PROD candidate, ineligible for soft deletion.
Please add new comments below this notice. Thanks, ✗plicit 05:46, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Paul Petrovski

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Non-notable businessman. Cited sources do not mention the subject at all, not even in passing. Article was speedy deleted under A7, and was immediately recreated by author. Could also qualify under WP:G11 though the article isn't blatantly promotional. Possible COI as well. CycloneYoris ^talk! 05:19, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Paul Petrovski is the founder of PCFS Logistics Pty Ltd and is also the major sponsor of Rockdale Ilinden FC. He has also had a amateur football career hence the addition of his football stats. 58.105.162.94 (talk) 05:54, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Paul Petrovski is the founder of PCFS Logistics Pty Ltd and is also the major sponsor of Rockdale Ilinden FC. He has also had a amateur football career hence the addition of his football stats. Tp767 (talk) 05:55, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. I've already deleted this once under A7, which clearly still applies—there's nothing to indicate any notability in Wikipedia terms. Playing non-league football and being the director of a company that's itself so obscure it doesn't even have a Wikipedia page clearly doesn't qualify. ‑ Iridescent 06:04, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Fails NBIO and SIGCOV. No indoependent coverage in reliable sources. Also, since this is a resurrected speedy delete, then this should be deleted and salted. ---Steve Quinn (talk) 06:27, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
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Delete - no evidence of notability. If sources are found which show significant coverage please ping me. Giant Snowman 10:48, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - did a big dive into football-specific sources and couldn't find a single mention Waterfelt (talk) 00:28, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]
Delete - clearly no evidence of notability. Bduke (talk) 02:17, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Isabel Drescher

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Non-notable figure skater; no senior-level international medal placements. Bgsu98 (Talk) 04:43, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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- Comment I have found a couple of things for her on the same website Westfalische Rundschau [54] and [55]. One of these is about her when she is very young and the other one is one long paragraph so still some way short of establishing notability but it gets the discussion started.Canary757 (talk) 07:11, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Caroline Gülke

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Non-notable figure skater; highest medal placement was silver at the German nationals. Bgsu98 (Talk) 03:36, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Comment: A brief google search turns up [[56]], which while paywalled appears to have WP:SIGCOV from what I can read. A couple of sentences here but not what I'd call SIGCOV [[57]]. The corresponding German article has no non-database sources, so that doesn't help the case for this subject. Still undecided here. Let'srun (talk) 21:40, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

OpenCoffee Club

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Fails WP:GNG. Insufficient independent in-depth sources to establish notability. Imcdc Contact 03:21, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Can't find anything for notability. There are a lot of trivial mentions to local clubs. The best sources with significant coverage I could find include: Local news source where the reporter has a conflict of interest (went to a meeting about a startup funded by her organization). Masters thesis, not reliable per WP:SCHOLARSHIP. readwrite.com article, a website that appears to have little to no editorial oversight. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 06:52, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Propeller Venture Accelerator

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Fails WP:NCORP. Insufficient independent in-depth sources to establish notability. Imcdc Contact 03:17, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete nothing significant found other than passing mentions. ww2censor (talk) 14:02, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
It's a close one. I found a book from 2017 that appears to have more than a passing mention, and the SiliconRepublic article is also definitely not trivial. That makes two seemingly independent and significant sources, which would be an WP:NCORP pass by the definition, but I don't actually have the book and I'm not sure of SiliconRepublic's reliability so I can't verify that this sticks the landing. This is a comment, not a vote. Tessaract2^Hi! 14:32, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
The website is down but we do have the archive here. Keep in mind this is from 2014 while SiliconRepublic is from 2011 so details will differ.

Looking at the SiliconRepublic lets see. The first two parts are what Terence Bowden, Venture manager at DCU Ryan Academy says so not independent. The seventh place ranking we can see is from the website. The overall package details seems to be copied or reworded from the website itself such as €30k package, office space, mentoring etc. Details might be different since website date is different but it feels like its just copied from there. There's details about mostly non-notable startups it has funded which can be traced to the portfolio that you can see here Its just a copy of website since even the order is the same. Then some interview from a related party. And finally the last part seems to be a generic boilerplate description.

Basically as you can see a large chunk of info from that SiliconRepublic article is either copied from the website or just quoting a related staff. It sort of telling the website itself is about the DCU Ryan Academy and the Propeller Venture Accelerator is just a section of it.

I guess we need to have a look at the book. Imcdc Contact 15:00, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for checking that in-depth! Since you need multiple sources that meet all guidelines to meet WP:NCORP, and I didn't find anything else from a WP:BEFORE, I'm now voting delete. Tessaract2^Hi! 15:12, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. No indication of notability. Nothing material found in a WP:BEFORE search. The COI/SPA overtones (and clearly promotional intent of the article's creation) are also difficult to overlook. Guliolopez (talk) 16:17, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Food insurance

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This company seems to be defunct, and was probably non-notable from the get-go. The website fails DNS, as do most of the cited sources. Being mentioned in a comedian's bit doesn't count to establish notability. Google search for "food insurance" produces no relevant results, and more focused searches just find this article. Cast it into the fire! -- LWG ^talk 03:12, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Don't see any sources that contribute towards notability. foodstoragereviewer.com was a self-published blog. The best I could find is a brief story from Talking Points Memo and an opinion piece from NYT. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 04:28, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete There's the Business Inside piece cited in the article and this piece from The Week: [58], but both of those are more about Glenn Beck than the company itself. WeirdNAnnoyed (talk) 13:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

1927 Finnish Figure Skating Championships

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I am also nominating the following related pages:

Non-notable figure skating competition. Recommend deletion or redirect to Finnish Figure Skating Championships. I will attach all subsequent competitions in this series shortly. Bgsu98 (Talk) 02:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Here is my problem with these stand-alone articles. All four disciplines are often not contested. There are often not enough competitors to award a bronze medal, and in some cases, even a silver medal. Many of these competitions featured no more than two or three participants. And most of the competitors who are listed are redlinked or unlinked (ie. themselves not notable). The competition results and scores are included (or should be included) on a skaters' individual article. The medal results are included on the parent article (in this case, Finnish Figure Skating Championships). But these nations with small national championships are just not worth trying to maintain individual articles for each competition. Bgsu98 (Talk) 02:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Redirect all to Finnish Figure Skating Championships. - The Bushranger _{One ping only} 02:59, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Alexender Melen

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Non-notable businessperson without sufficient coverage to meet WP:NBIO. See also Wikipedia:Articles for deletion/SmartSites, which was also created by the creator of this page. Helpful Raccoon (talk) 02:09, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

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Delete: Non-notable business person; sourced only to PR items. My search turns up no RS. The company is not notable either, as discussed there, so the person in charge there would not be notable either. Oaktree b (talk) 02:13, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete. Promotional page; sources are Q&A interviews, ORGTRIV of his business, other non-qualifying material. Nothing to pass WP:GNG or WP:NBIO. Dclemens1971 (talk) 03:04, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete as the article provides none of the in-depth coverage in reliable and verifiable sources that would be needed to establish notability, nor was anything meaningful found in a Google search. Alansohn (talk) 13:12, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Glokk40Spaz

AfDs for this article:

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Fails WP:GNG. Laun chba ller 01:48, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Bands and musicians and Georgia (U.S. state). WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:21, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

2022 Detroit shootings

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Not notable WP:ROUTINE shooting in an area prone to this type of thing - fails WP:LASTING Cutlass ^Ciera 01:47, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Crime, Events, and Michigan. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:22, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete. Per nom, badly fails sustained. Not even routine trial update stuff. PARAKANYAA (talk) 08:44, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Delete Among the worst WP:NOTNEWS failures I've seen. WeirdNAnnoyed (talk) 13:49, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Really? Maybe I've been here too long. PARAKANYAA (talk) 13:53, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete Another WP:MILL shooting article from one of the worst purveyors of this here, Cyanidethistles (talk · contribs), who is thankfully blocked; article is uncomfortably detailed (a link to pedicide is beyond the pale) and likely still contains some kind of COPYVIO (which they were blocked for). Nate • (chatter) 17:30, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]
Delete, clearly fails WP:NOTNEWS. Esolo5002 (talk) 04:24, 1 January 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Tina Albanese

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This person doesn't seem notable enough to me. I cannot find any news coverage about her. Aŭstriano (talk) 01:21, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

Note: This discussion has been included in the deletion sorting lists for the following topics: Actors and filmmakers, Women, Television, and United States of America. WCQuidditch ☎ ✎ 04:23, 31 December 2024 (UTC)[reply]

[1] My opinion in the previous AfD was: "This list is not inherently inappropriate, and could be improved, but the timing of its creation is certainly suspect and it is likely to be a vandalism magnet in the near future if kept. As such I think it should be workshopped in draftspace until it meets a higher standard. It can be moved back into mainspace later, provided that it has been sufficiently improved and there is consensus among editors to do so."

[a]